The discussion centers on motorcycle physics, specifically the concepts of countersteering and bodysteering. Participants explore the mechanics of how a rider's weight shift affects the motorcycle's center of gravity and lean angle, particularly in scenarios involving real-world friction and tire dynamics. Key insights include the effectiveness of bodysteering as a method to initiate turns without relying solely on countersteering, especially in emergency situations where rider tension can hinder performance. The conversation also references Reg Pridmore's CLASS schools and Keith Code's "No BS" sportbike, highlighting the practical applications and limitations of these steering techniques.
PREREQUISITESMotorcycle enthusiasts, riding instructors, and anyone interested in improving their riding skills or understanding the physics behind motorcycle maneuvering.
As long as there is friction between the road and tires, it is very unlikely that bike's movement will completely cancel out rider's movement one way or the other, the hard but I think is which way that will bercgldr said:I don't think there is a reliable way to do this. Again, using the bike on a tight wire comparison, the long balance pole weighs more than the bike, in order to maintain balance on such a system.
rcgldr said:I don't think there is a reliable way to do this. Again, using the bike on a tight wire comparison, the long balance pole weighs more than the bike, in order to maintain balance on such a system.
What I meant is that the rider ends up leaning the wrong way after the initial application of force. However, once gravity takes over and causes the system to continue to fall, the rider can then lean the correct way since that won't prevent the system form continuing to fall.Erunanethiel said:As long as there is friction between the road and tires, it is very unlikely that bike's movement will completely cancel out rider's movement one way or the other, the hard but I think is which way that will be
Oh what you said is there is not a reliable way to push the bike and then the rider ending up leaning the same way the system is turning to right? The rider can shift his weight to offset the center of mass of the system horizontally with a bike with no trail, but he would end up leaning the wrong way is what you are saying, have I got it right?rcgldr said:What I meant is that the rider ends up leaning the wrong way after the initial application of force. However, once gravity takes over and causes the system to continue to fall, the rider can then lean the correct way since that won't prevent the system form continuing to fall.
The rider initially ends up leaning the wrong way, but once the system is leaning, then gravity becomes the dominant factor, and the rider can then lean the correct way, since the rider's movements won't be enough to prevent the system from continuing to fall over, at which point steering inputs will be needed.Erunanethiel said:Oh what you said is there is not a reliable way to push the bike and then the rider ending up leaning the same way the system is turning to right? The rider can shift his weight to offset the center of mass of the system horizontally with a bike with no trail, but he would end up leaning the wrong way is what you are saying, have I got it right?
So the bottom line on this thread is that, it is possible to change the horizontal position of the center of mass of the system with body weight shifts on a bike with no trail geometry, but you would need to "catch" the bike through handlebar inputs to stop the bike from falling. I guess if you confirm what I said is the case, we can call it done!rcgldr said:The rider initially ends up leaning the wrong way, but once the system is leaning, then gravity becomes the dominant factor, and the rider can then lean the correct way, since the rider's movements won't be enough to prevent the system from continuing to fall over, at which point steering inputs will be needed.
Correct.Erunanethiel said:So the bottom line on this thread is that, it is possible to change the horizontal position of the center of mass of the system with body weight shifts on a bike with no trail geometry, but you would need to "catch" the bike through handlebar inputs to stop the bike from falling. I guess if you confirm what I said is the case, we can call it done!