Multivariable Derivative Error

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the function f(x,y) defined piecewise, specifically examining its differentiability at the point (0,0) using multivariable calculus concepts. Participants are tasked with showing that a certain limit involving the error term E(v,h) does not approach zero, indicating potential issues with differentiability.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Conceptual clarification

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants express uncertainty about how to approach the problem, with some comparing slopes instead of using formal multivariable calculus methods. Questions arise regarding the definition and implications of the error term E(v,h) and its relationship to differentiability.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants seeking clarification on the concept of E(v,h) and its significance in the context of the problem. Some guidance has been offered regarding the nature of directional derivatives and their linearity, but no consensus has been reached on the validity of the initial approaches or the correctness of the equations presented.

Contextual Notes

Participants note confusion regarding the notation and definitions involved, particularly in relation to the function's behavior near the origin. There are indications of potential misunderstandings about the assumptions necessary for the limit to hold.

Kitty Kat
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Homework Statement


f(x,y) =
(xy) / (x2 + y4), when (x, y) ≠ (0,0)
0, when (x,y) = (0,0)

Homework Equations


Explicitly show that f(x,y) does not satisfy
lim h -> 0 [ E(v,h) / ||h|| ] = 0 when v = 0
(h, v, and 0 are all vectors; I'm not sure how to put a hat on them)

The Attempt at a Solution


I have no idea how to actually tackle this problem using multivariable calculus methods so I just compared the slopes instead (not sure if this is a valid approach either).
Further more I don't really get the concept of E(v,h). All my professor said is that it should approach 0 if the function is differentiable. I'd really appreciate an explanation of E(v,h) please (:

f(h) = f(0,0) + (df/dx(0,0) * x) + (df/dy(0,0) * y) + E(h)
f(h) = 0 + 0x + 0y + E(h)
f(h) = E(h)

Let f(x,y) = f(h,h)
f(h,h) = h / (1+h2)
f'(h) = (-h2 + 1) / (1+h2)2

||h|| = 2h2
f'(||h||) = 4h

lim h-> 0 [ f'(h) / f'(||h||) ] = ∞
 
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Kitty Kat said:

Homework Statement


f(x,y) =
(xy) / (x2 + y4), when (x, y) ≠ (0,0)
0, when (x,y) = (0,0)

Homework Equations


Explicitly show that f(x,y) does not satisfy
lim h -> 0 [ E(v,h) / ||h|| ] = 0 when v = 0
(h, v, and 0 are all vectors; I'm not sure how to put a hat on them)

The Attempt at a Solution


I have no idea how to actually tackle this problem using multivariable calculus methods so I just compared the slopes instead (not sure if this is a valid approach either).
Further more I don't really get the concept of E(v,h). All my professor said is that it should approach 0 if the function is differentiable. I'd really appreciate an explanation of E(v,h) please (:

f(h) = f(0,0) + (df/dx(0,0) * x) + (df/dy(0,0) * y) + E(h)
f(h) = 0 + 0x + 0y + E(h)
f(h) = E(h)

Let f(x,y) = f(h,h)
f(h,h) = h / (1+h2)
f'(h) = (-h2 + 1) / (1+h2)2

||h|| = 2h2
f'(||h||) = 4h

lim h-> 0 [ f'(h) / f'(||h||) ] = ∞
Do you have a definition of E(v,h)?
 
SammyS said:
Do you have a definition of E(v,h)?
Not quite exactly. Here's a picture of my notes since I don't know how to type it here with proper notation.
Link: https://dl.pushbulletusercontent.com/wwTIGu5Cjgt9OlhFWP6geOc1nuuUgJJX/20151024_164749.jpg
20151024_164749.jpg
 
I get a virus warning when I try to open that.
 
Kitty Kat said:

Homework Statement


f(x,y) =
(xy) / (x2 + y4), when (x, y) ≠ (0,0)
0, when (x,y) = (0,0)

Homework Equations


Explicitly show that f(x,y) does not satisfy
lim h -> 0 [ E(v,h) / ||h|| ] = 0 when v = 0
(h, v, and 0 are all vectors; I'm not sure how to put a hat on them)

The Attempt at a Solution


I have no idea how to actually tackle this problem using multivariable calculus methods so I just compared the slopes instead (not sure if this is a valid approach either).
Further more I don't really get the concept of E(v,h). All my professor said is that it should approach 0 if the function is differentiable. I'd really appreciate an explanation of E(v,h) please (:

f(h) = f(0,0) + (df/dx(0,0) * x) + (df/dy(0,0) * y) + E(h)
f(h) = 0 + 0x + 0y + E(h)
f(h) = E(h)

Let f(x,y) = f(h,h)
f(h,h) = h / (1+h2)
f'(h) = (-h2 + 1) / (1+h2)2

||h|| = 2h2
f'(||h||) = 4h

lim h-> 0 [ f'(h) / f'(||h||) ] = ∞

Some of your equations make no sense, or else are not true for your current function. For example, your "formula" for ##f(h)## has only ##h## on one side and ##x,y## on the other; that does not mean anything. Besides that, even if we were to correct the formula, it might be false for your function, because it makes some assumptions about the nature of the function in a neighborhood of ##(0,0)## that may not hold for your ##f(x,y)##.

Basically, if we define the directional derivative of f at the point ##(x_0,y_0)## in the direction ##(p,q)## as
D_{(p,q)} f(x_0,y_0) = \lim_{t \to 0} \frac{f(x_0 + t p, y_0 + t q) - f(x_0,y_0)}{t},
then, in order for your result about ##E(h)## to hold, it is necessary (but perhaps not sufficient) that ##D_{(p,q)} f(x_0,y_0)## be linear in ##(p,q)##; that is, it would be necessary to have ##D_{(p,q)} f(x_0,y_0) = a p + b q## for some real numbers ##a## and ##b##. Is that true at ##(x_0,y_0) = (0,0)## in your current example?
 
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Kitty Kat said:
Furthermore, I don't really get the concept of E(v,h). All my professor said is that it should approach 0 if the function is differentiable. I'd really appreciate an explanation of E(v,h) please (:
Read this page: http://www.math.ku.edu/~lerner/m291F08/Chapter9.pdf
 
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