Neurophysics: speed of neurons

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between the speed of electrical signals in the brain, consciousness, and the hypothetical transfer of consciousness to a cloned body. Participants explore concepts related to neurophysics, consciousness, and the mechanics of neural signals.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Speculative

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the delay in electrical signal transmission between the right and left hemispheres of the brain and its impact on consciousness.
  • Another participant asserts that the speed of nerve impulses is significantly less than the speed of light, challenging the assumption that electrical signals travel at light speed.
  • Some participants discuss the integration of sensory inputs in the brain and suggest that consciousness may not rely on synchronization of signals.
  • There is a proposal regarding the cloning of a body without consciousness and the potential for transferring consciousness using lasers or masers to match electrical signals.
  • Concerns are raised about the speculative nature of transferring consciousness and the definition of consciousness itself.
  • Participants note that electric signals do not move at the speed of light and provide examples of how the speed of electric field disturbances varies in different media.
  • Discussion includes the slow nature of synaptic transmission compared to the speed of electrical signals in neurons.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views on the nature of electrical signal transmission, consciousness, and the feasibility of transferring consciousness. There is no consensus on these topics, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the assumptions made about the speed of electrical signals, the nature of consciousness, and the mechanisms of neural communication. The discussion also highlights the speculative aspects of consciousness transfer and cloning.

fredreload
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I think this is more of a Neurophysics question and I am just asking a question with no experience in this field. I know the consciousness works because the neurons can send electrical signals within the brain. If I assume the right and left brain is apart from each other and the right brain is sending a signal to the left brain.

From where the brain is apart from each other and the electrical signal cannot pass to the other side of the brain I would create a new electrical signal to match the signal on the other side of the brain even though it is apart from each other. I know electrical signal travels at the speed of light.

If someone has an identical brain to mine and his right or left brain has the same signal matching my brain then technically our brain can function as one. If I have an arm long enough to circle the Earth three and a half time and I touch the ground, I should be able to feel my hand touching the ground one second after because light travels the Earth three and a half times in one second.

The problem is if I have a one second delay in between the traveling electrical signal between my right brain and my left brain then the consciousness might not work out. The same reason I do not feel other person's consciousness because his mind has electrical signal traveling with a different timing. My question is, how long of a delay can I have between the traveling electrical signal between my right brain and my left brain and I would still have my consciousness?
 
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We don't know. There's really not much that we do know about the connection between the mechanical workings of the brain and nervous system on the one hand, and consciousness on the other.

If you can get hold of Daniel Dennett's book "Consciousness Explained" (the title is, to put it gently, a bit optimistic) it will give you a pretty good sense of where we are with this question.
 
fredreload said:
I know electrical signal travels at the speed of light.
The speed of nerve impulses is much much less than the speed of light.

If someone has an identical brain to mine and his right or left brain has the same signal matching my brain then technically our brain can function as one.
Why do you think this?

If I have an arm long enough to circle the Earth three and a half time and I touch the ground, I should be able to feel my hand touching the ground one second after because light travels the Earth three and a half times in one second. The problem is if I have a one second delay in between the traveling electrical signal between my right brain and my left brain then the consciousness might not work out. The same reason I do not feel other person's consciousness because his mind has electrical signal traveling with a different timing. My question is, how long of a delay can I have between the traveling electrical signal between my right brain and my left brain and I would still have my consciousness?
I believe the brain constantly 'integrates' inputs over time and creates an illusion that those inputs happened simultaneously. But I'd better let the experts answer that one.
 
So many misconceptions!

1) Electric signals don't move at the speed of light.
2) Light can move 7 1/2 times around the Earth in one second. That's more than 3 1/2 times.
3) Consciousness has nothing to do with Synchronization.
4) Your different senses are NOT as synchronized as you seem to believe.
5) You can't be conscious of somebody else's brain because there is no connection between the two brains
6) Your left and right brain hemispheres are connected to each other.
 
dauto said:
So many misconceptions!

1) Electric signals don't move at the speed of light.

Because of the dielectric material? Electric field disturbances, which is what the signals are, do propagate at the speed of light as far as I know. If there is a medium then it propagates at the speed of light in that medium. No?
 
ModusPwnd said:
Because of the dielectric material? Electric field disturbances, which is what the signals are, do propagate at the speed of light as far as I know. If there is a medium then it propagates at the speed of light in that medium. No?

In copper wire the field travels ~0.8 c.

In regular glass (index of refraction=1.5) the field travels ~ 2/3 c.

In water (index of refraction=1.33) the field travels ~3/4 c.

But while the electric signal inside a neuron may travel pretty fast, crossing the synapse is an electrochemical process - and is quite slow, perhaps 100 meters per second, but often slower.
 
If I clone the body of myself that does not develop consciousness then I can transfer my consciousness to it. The problem is how to clone a body without consciousness and what would be the possible replacement for the brain?
 
fredreload said:
If I clone the body of myself that does not develop consciousness then I can transfer my consciousness to it.
Oh really? How might you do that?
 
If there is consciousness to transfer to a clone body developed without a consciousness's brain. I think I would use a maser or laser to match the electrical signal of the brain and transfer the signal to the clone body developed without a consciousness's brain. Thereby slowly transferring the consciousness to the clone body developed without a consciousness's brain.
 
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fredreload said:
If there is consciousness to transfer to a clone body developed without a consciousness's brain. I think I would use a maser or laser to match the electrical signal of the brain and transfer the signal to the clone body developed without a consciousness's brain. Thereby slowly transferring the consciousness to the clone body developed without a consciousness's brain.

This is no longer physics, and it involves a huge amount of speculation, i.e. what is this "consciousness" that you think you can transfer?

Topic closed.

Zz.
 

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