Normal group of order 60 isomorphic to A_5

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the properties of a group of order 60, specifically examining its structure and potential isomorphism to the alternating group A_5. Participants explore implications of Sylow's theorems and the characteristics of Sylow subgroups.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Conceptual clarification

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the implications of Sylow's theorems on the number of Sylow subgroups and their orders. There are attempts to prove hints regarding the intersection of distinct Sylow subgroups and the order of elements within those groups. Questions arise about the implications of certain subgroup orders and how they affect the overall structure of the group.

Discussion Status

The discussion is active, with participants providing insights and reasoning related to the properties of Sylow subgroups. Some participants have offered guidance on proving certain aspects of the problem, while others are seeking clarification on specific points, particularly regarding the orders of centralizers and their implications.

Contextual Notes

Participants are working under the constraints of group theory, specifically focusing on groups of order 60 and the application of Sylow's theorems. There is an ongoing examination of assumptions regarding subgroup intersections and element orders, which are critical to the discussion.

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Homework Statement
Prove that any simple group ##G## of order ##60## is isomorphic to ##A_5##. (Hint. If ##P## and ##Q## are distinct Sylow ##2## subgroups having a nontrivial element ##x## in their intersection, then ##C_G(x)## has index ##5##; otherwise, every two Sylow ##2## subgroups intersect trivially and ##N_G(P)## has index ##5##.
Relevant Equations
Theorem: Let ##H## be a subgroup of ##G## with index ##n##. Then there exists homomorphism ##\psi : G \rightarrow S_n##.

Sylow's Theorem: Let ##p## be a prime divisor of ##G## and ##n_p## be the number of Sylow p subgroups of ##G##. Then ##n_p \vert \vert G \vert## and ##n_p = 1 (mod p)##. Also, the Sylow ##p## subgroups are conjugate to one another.
Proof: We note ##60 = 2^2\cdot3\cdot5##. By Sylow's theorem, ##n_5 = 1## or ##6##. Since ##G## is simple, we have ##n_5 = 6##. By Sylow's theorem, ##n_3 = 1, 4, ## or ##10##. Since ##G## is simple, ##n_3 \neq 1##. Let ##H## be a Sylow ##3## subgroup and suppose ##n_3 = 4##. Then ##[N_G(H) : G] = 4## which implies there is homomorphism ##\psi : G \rightarrow S_4##. But ##\ker \psi = 1##. By 1st iso, ##S_4## contains a subgroup isomorphic to ##G##. But ##S_4## contains strictly less elements than ##G##, contradiction. Hence, ##n_3 \neq 4##. We may conclude ##n_3 = 10##. Hence ##G## contains ##1## element of order ##1##, ##24## elements of order ##5##, and ##20## elements of order ##3##.

By Sylow's theorem, ##n_2 = 1, 3, 5,## or ##15##. By a similar argument as above, we see ##n_2 \neq 1, 3##. I think we need to show ##n_2 = 5## but I'm not sure how.

I'm also having trouble with the first part of the hint: Suppose there are distinct Sylow ##2## subgroups ##P \cap Q## that don't interact trivially. Let ##x \in P \cap Q## be a nonidentity element. Then ##x## has order ##2##. I see that if I can prove the hint, then there is an homorphism ##\psi : G\rightarrow S_5## with ##ker \psi = 1##. And therefore ##G## iso. to ##A_5##(i think...) But I'm having trouble with the first part of the hint. How can I proceed, please?
 
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Let me start with proving the hint.

Note first that it is possible that ##x## has order 4. You don't necessarily know that ##x## has order ##2##. What you do know is that by Cayley's theorem that ##P\cap Q## contains some element of order ##2##. Alright, since ##P,Q## are groups of order ##4## , they are abelian so you know that ##x## commutes with every element in ## P## and ##Q## hence, since P
##P## and ##Q## are distinct you know that ##x## commutes with at least 5 distinct elements´. Hence ##|C_G(x)|\geq 5## and thus since this order also divides ##60## we have ##|C_G(x)|\geq 12## (order ##6## is not possible since then this centraliser contains a subgroup of order 3 and then we have ##5+2## distinct elements already), so the index is at most ##5##.

If ##n=[G:C_G(x)]##, then ##G## acts on the cosets of ##C_G(x)## and we have an induced group morphism ##G\to \operatorname{Sym}(G/C_G(x))\cong S_n## and since ##G## is simple the kernel is trivial so this is an injection´. Hence, ##60=|G|\leq n!##, from which it follows that ##n\geq 5##.
 
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Thank you! My only question is, how did we rule out ##C_G(x) \neq 10##?

Proof: Let ##P, Q## be distinct Sylow ##2## subgroups of ##G##. Suppose ##P, Q## do not intersect trivially. Then there exists non identity element ##x \in P \cap Q##. Since ##P, Q## have order ##4##, they are abelian. Hence, ##x## commutes with at least ##5## elements. We note these ##5## elements have order ##1, 2## or ##4##. So, ##\vert C_G(x) \vert \ge 5##. We know ##\vert C_G(x) \vert \vert 60##. If ##C_G(x) \ge 15##, then we can find an injective homomorphism ##\psi : G \rightarrow S_k## for some ##k \le 4##. Since ##G## has more elements than ##S_k## for ##k \le 4##, we can conclude ##C_G(x) \le 12##.

From a previous note, ##\vert C_G(x) \vert \neq 5## since it contains an element of order ##2## or ##4##. So, ##\vert C_G(x) \vert = 10## or ##12##. So, the index of ##C_G(x)## is ##5## or ##6##.

If ##n = [G : C_G(x)]##, then there is an homomorphism ##\psi : G \rightarrow S_n## with ##\ker \psi = 1##. Hence, ##G## is isomorphic to some subgroup of ##S_n##. This implies ##\vert G \vert \le n!##. So, ##n \ge 5##.

On the other hand, suppose any two distinct Sylow ##2## subgroups of ##G## intersect trivially. In the OP, we see ##n_2 = 5## or ##15##. If ##n_2 = 15##, then we get ##45## elements in addition to the ##45## we've already found, a contradiction. Hence, ##n_2 = 5##. Let ##P## be a Sylow ##2## subgroup. Then ##\vert \mathcal{O}(P) \vert = 5## where ##\mathcal{O}(P)## is the orbit of ##G## acting on ##P## by conjugation.

In either case, we've found a subgroup of ##G## with index ##5##. So there is an homomorphism ##\psi: G \rightarrow S_5## with ##\ker\psi = 1##. So, ##G## is isomorphic to some subgroup of ##S_5## of order ##60##. The only such subgroup of ##S_5## is ##A_5##. Hence, ##G \cong A_5##.[]
 
Response to post #4

I think I can do the element of order ##2## part, but showing ##N_G(x)## has index ##5## has me stuck, unless we use post #2.

Proof: Continuing from the OP, we have ##n_2 = 5## or ##15##. Suppose ##n_2 = 5## and let ##P## be a Sylow 2 subgroup of ##G##. Then ##N_G(P)## has index ##5##.

On the other hand, suppose ##n_2 = 15##. Then there's exactly ##15## distinct Sylow 2 subgroups. If all pairs of these intersect trivially, then we get ##45## new elements in addition to the 45 we already found (in the OP), a contradiction. So there must be distinct Sylow 2 subgroups ##P## and ##Q## such that ##P \cap Q \neq 1##. Let ##x \in P \cap Q## be a nonidentity element. If the order of ##x = 4##, then it generates both ##P## and ##Q##, a contradiction. Hence, the order of ##x## is ##2##.
 
fishturtle1 said:
Thank you! My only question is, how did we rule out ##C_G(x) \neq 10##?
##C_G(x)## contains ##P##, a group of order ##4##. Thus ##4## divides the order of ##C_G(x)## and thus this cannot be of order ##6## or ##10##.

Let me know if you need any further help!
 
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Math_QED said:
##C_G(x)## contains ##P##, a group of order ##4##. Thus ##4## divides the order of ##C_G(x)## and thus this cannot be of order ##6## or ##10##.

Let me know if you need any further help!
That makes sense, thank you again!
 
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