Particle in XY Plane Homework: Separating Variables

  • Thread starter Thread starter gfd43tg
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Particle Plane
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the separation of variables in the context of a particle in the XY plane, specifically addressing the Hamiltonian formulation and the implications of a potential that is a function of radius. The original poster attempts to separate the wave function into radial and angular components but encounters difficulties due to the non-constant potential.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the implications of taking additional derivatives and how it affects the separation of variables. Questions arise regarding the nature of the potential and its impact on the Hamiltonian, as well as the interpretation of angular derivatives.

Discussion Status

There is an ongoing exploration of the mathematical structure of the problem, with some participants suggesting specific manipulations of the Hamiltonian to facilitate separation. The conversation reflects a mix of interpretations and approaches, with no explicit consensus reached on the next steps.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the potential confusion in the problem statement regarding the types of solutions that can be expressed through separation of variables, particularly in relation to superpositions of states. The discussion also highlights the challenge posed by the non-constant potential in the Hamiltonian.

gfd43tg
Gold Member
Messages
949
Reaction score
48

Homework Statement


upload_2015-5-19_22-23-32.png
upload_2015-5-19_22-23-51.png

upload_2015-5-19_22-24-17.png

upload_2015-5-19_22-24-34.png


Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


a) I know that I am allowed to separate variables, such that ##\psi (r, \theta) = R(r) \Theta(\theta)##, but the part with the exponential is yet to be seen. So I put it into the Hamiltonian,
$$H = - \frac {\hbar^{2}}{2 \mu} \Big ( \frac {1}{R} \frac {\partial^{2} R}{\partial r^{2}} + \frac {1}{R} \frac {1}{r} \frac {\partial R}{\partial r} + \frac {1}{r^{2}} \frac {1}{\Theta} \frac {\partial^{2} \Theta}{\partial \theta^{2}} \Big ) + V $$

Since V is a function of r, it is not a constant, so I can't just call every term with derivatives as constants, can I? This is what I would normally be able to do, particularly if V = 0. So how do I proceed from here?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
You can take another angular derivative, then all the non-trivial R terms will go away.
The problem statement is misleading, there are solutions that cannot be written in that way, e.g. superpositions of states with different m.[/size]
 
What is the other angular derivative you are talking about? I just see the one in my equation.
 
"Another" as in "one more". You can calculate ##\frac{dH}{d\theta}##.
 
Wouldn't that give some sort of triple derivative on the right side of my equation for the third term in the parenthesis?
 
It might help you to write out the complete equation.
$$-\frac{\hbar^2}{2\mu}\left(\frac{R''}{R} + \frac{R'}{rR} + \frac{\Theta'}{r^2\Theta}\right) + V = E.$$ Multiply by ##r^2## and you can separate the terms into those depending on ##r## and those that depend only on ##\theta##.
 
Okay, so I can separate the equation

$$ -(H-V)r^{2} \frac {2 \mu}{\hbar^{2}} - \frac {r^{2}}{R} R'' - \frac {r}{R} R' = \frac {\Theta''}{\Theta} $$
But how can I solve this?
 
The left side is independent of theta, which means the whole equation has to have the same value for all values of theta. You can set the left side equal to some constant (it will depend on r but not on theta). This is the same as setting the derivative (with respect to theta) to zero.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
4K
Replies
29
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
1K
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 30 ·
2
Replies
30
Views
4K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
4K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
Replies
10
Views
2K