Problem studying the convergence of a series

Click For Summary
The discussion centers on the confusion regarding the convergence of a series involving the Taylor expansion of sin((n^2+n+1)/(n+1) * π). The original poster mistakenly applies the first-order Taylor expansion, leading to an incorrect conclusion about divergence. Key points clarify that the approximation sin(x) ≈ x is valid only for x close to zero, and in this case, sin(f(n) * π) converges to zero as f(n) approaches n. Participants emphasize the importance of maintaining accuracy in calculations before applying approximations. The conversation concludes with the poster expressing gratitude for the clarification.
Amaelle
Messages
309
Reaction score
54
Homework Statement
Convergence of a serie (look at the image)
Relevant Equations
absolute convergence, taylor expnasion, asymptotic behaviour!
Good day
here is the exercice
1612086383866.png

and here is the solution that I understand very well
1612086450657.png


but I have a confusion I hope someone can explain me
if I take the taylor expansion of sin ((n^2+n+1/(n+1))*pi)≈n^2+n+1/(n+1))*pi≈n*pi which diverge!
I know something is wrong in my logic please help me

many thanks in advance!
best regards!
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Amaelle said:
Homework Statement:: Convergence of a serie (look at the image)
Relevant Equations:: absolute convergence, taylor expnasion, asymptotic behaviour!

if I take the taylor expansion of sin ((n^2+n+1/(n+1))*pi)≈n^2+n+1/(n+1))*pi≈n*pi which diverge!
This is what you get by a quick, but wrong look at it. To cut off all the rest of the Taylor series gives you a false impression. With this method you either have to use the complete series or investigate merely absolute convergence, in which case you need the triangle inequality.

Anyway, the point is, that a) ##\sin(x)\approx x## only holds for ##x\ll 1## and b) that we actually have ##\sin(f(n)\cdot \pi )## with ##f(n)=\dfrac{n^2+n+1}{n+1}## which itself converges to ##n\pi## and ##\sin(n\pi)=0##.

Hence we add numbers which are close to zero. We know from ##\sum \dfrac{1}{n} \to \infty ##, ##\sum \dfrac{1}{n^2} \to \pi^2/6 ##, and ##\sum (-1)^n\dfrac{1}{n} \to -\log(2)## that in such cases we have to have a close look on "how close to zero". This means that we must keep equality as long as possible before we can start to simplify by Taylor or other means. That is where the addition theorem comes into play.

It is generally a good advice for any calculation: Stay accurate as long as possible and turn to estimations and approximations at the very last.
 
Amaelle said:
Homework Statement:: Convergence of a serie (look at the image)
Relevant Equations:: absolute convergence, taylor expnasion, asymptotic behaviour!

if I take the taylor expansion of sin ((n^2+n+1/(n+1))*pi)≈n^2+n+1/(n+1))*pi≈n*pi which diverge!

You seem to take only first order of Taylor expansion. It is no good because
\frac{n^2+n+1}{n+1}=n+\frac{1}{n+1}>1
We should remove ##n## to apply Taylor series properly as the text does.
 
fresh_42 said:
This is what you get by a quick, but wrong look at it. To cut off all the rest of the Taylor series gives you a false impression. With this method you either have to use the complete series or investigate merely absolute convergence, in which case you need the triangle inequality.

Anyway, the point is, that a) ##\sin(x)\approx x## only holds for ##x\ll 1## and b) that we actually have ##\sin(f(n)\cdot \pi )## with ##f(n)=\dfrac{n^2+n+1}{n+1}## which itself converges to ##n\pi## and ##\sin(n\pi)=0##.

Hence we add numbers which are close to zero. We know from ##\sum \dfrac{1}{n} \to \infty ##, ##\sum \dfrac{1}{n^2} \to \pi^2/6 ##, and ##\sum (-1)^n\dfrac{1}{n} \to -\log(2)## that in such cases we have to have a close look on "how close to zero". This means that we must keep equality as long as possible before we can start to simplify by Taylor or other means. That is where the addition theorem comes into play.

It is generally a good advice for any calculation: Stay accurate as long as possible and turn to estimations and approximations at the very last.
thanks a million it's clear now!
 
anuttarasammyak said:
You seem to take only first order of Taylor expansion. It is no good because
\frac{n^2+n+1}{n+1}=n+\frac{1}{n+1}>1
We should remove ##n## to apply Taylor series properly as the text does.
thanks a million for this nice shot!
 
Question: A clock's minute hand has length 4 and its hour hand has length 3. What is the distance between the tips at the moment when it is increasing most rapidly?(Putnam Exam Question) Answer: Making assumption that both the hands moves at constant angular velocities, the answer is ## \sqrt{7} .## But don't you think this assumption is somewhat doubtful and wrong?

Similar threads

  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K