Question about infimums and closed sets

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the properties of closed sets and infimums in the context of a B*-space. The original poster is exploring whether certain conditions regarding the infimum of distances imply contradictions related to the closedness of the set χ.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to understand the implications of having an infimum that is not an element of a closed set and questions whether this leads to a contradiction. They also express uncertainty about the nature of limit points in relation to the infimum.
  • Another participant suggests a geometric example involving closed sets in the xy-plane to illustrate the concept of infimum and distance.
  • Further discussion includes considerations of fixed points and how they relate to the infimum in the context of the examples provided.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants exploring different examples and counterexamples to clarify the concepts involved. There is no explicit consensus yet, but various interpretations of the problem are being examined.

Contextual Notes

Participants are working within the constraints of definitions related to closed sets and infimums, and there is an acknowledgment of the complexity of these concepts in higher-dimensional spaces.

Fractal20
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Homework Statement


So this question arose out of a question about showing that a set χ is dense in γ a B* space with norm ||.||, but I think I can safely jump to where my question arises. I think I was able to solve the problem in another way, but one approach I tried came to this crux and I wasn't sure if I was correct.

Suppose that χ is closed and that we have both that inf x ε χ ||y-x|| = c for all y in γ and that ||y-x|| > C for some y in γ and for all x in χ.

My question is if this is a contradiction. It seems like that the above would imply that the infimum is something that is not an element of χ, but then by definition of infimum there must be elements in χ such that for any ε > 0 ||y-x|| < ε + C. Then I want to say it seems like this infimum is a limit point of χ which contradicts χ being closed. However, I am concerned that this is incorrect and that really the infimum is a limit point of y - χ not χ.

I'm not sure if this was clear or not. I guess my concern is that there existing elements x of χ such that ||y-x|| is arbitrarily close to ||y - infimum|| does not necessarily mean that there elements of χ that approach the infimum. In fact, when I put it like that, I think that perhaps it is not a contradiction. I think I just don't have a clear idea of infimum's of more complex sets. Thanks for your time!

Homework Equations


The Attempt at a Solution

 
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Draw an example in the xy plane. Take X={(x,y):y>=1+1/x for x>0} and Y={(x,y):y<=0}. Both X and Y are closed, right? The infimum of ||a-b|| for a in X and b in Y is 1. What happens if you try to find pairs of points whose distance is arbitrarily close to 1?
 
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One thing is that ||y-x|| > C for a fixed y and any x and I think that in the counter example you gave for any fixed y, the infimum of ||y-x|| would be equal to ||y-r|| where r is actually in X. Does the y being fixed change anything?
 
Fractal20 said:
One thing is that ||y-x|| > C for a fixed y and any x and I think that in the counter example you gave for any fixed y, the infimum of ||y-x|| would be equal to ||y-r|| where r is actually in X. Does the y being fixed change anything?

Maybe I'm not understanding what the question is, but then try this one. Take the space of all points in the plane with rational coordinates. Take X={(x,y):x^2+y^2<=1} (x,y rational of course). Take Y={(1,1)}. Then the infimum is sqrt(2)-1. But there is no point in X that has that minimum value. X is closed, but it isn't compact.
 

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