Right translations of orthonormal bases.

  • Thread starter Thread starter Kreizhn
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Bases
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The problem involves the right translation of orthonormal bases within the context of Lie groups and their associated Lie algebras, specifically focusing on the preservation of orthonormality under the right-translation operator in a Riemannian manifold setting.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the implications of using different inner products, such as the Killing form, and question its properties like non-degeneracy and positive definiteness. There is also consideration of whether orthonormality is preserved under parallel transport in Riemannian geometry.

Discussion Status

There is an ongoing exploration of the conditions under which orthonormality is preserved, with some participants suggesting that using the Levi-Cevita connection may resolve concerns. Multiple interpretations regarding the nature of unitarity and the appropriate metric for the Lie algebra are being examined.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the complexity introduced by the transition from Riemannian to sub-Riemannian geometry and the implications of working with different types of metrics on the Lie algebra.

Kreizhn
Messages
714
Reaction score
1

Homework Statement


Let G be a Lie group and L be its Lie algebra. Further assume that TG is equiped with a metric tensor g; that is, a (0,2)-covariant tensor that is symmetric and positive-definite on fibres of TG. Assume that [itex]\{ H_i\}_{i=1}^m[/itex] are an orthonormal basis for for L. If [itex]R_X: G \to G[/itex] is the right-translation operator acting as [itex]R_X(Y) = Y\cdot X[/itex] with [itex]\cdot[/itex] the group operation, show that for any [itex]X \in G[/itex] the set [itex]\{ dR_X H_i \}_{i=1}^m[/itex] form an orthonormal basis for [itex]T_X G[/itex].

The Attempt at a Solution



So via recent posts here, we know that [itex]dR_X H_i = H_i X[/itex]. Consider the "inner-product" on [itex]T_X G[/itex] given by [itex]\langle \cdot,\cdot \rangle[/itex]. Then we want to show that
[tex]\langle H_i X, H_j X \rangle = \delta_{ij}[/tex]
Now, I really don't think we can do anything more here without an explicit expression for the inner-product, or at least some consideration of what the group G is.

For my purposes, G is the unitary group [itex]G = \mathfrak U(N)[/itex]. Now normally when we do inner-products on Hilbert spaces, we can normally jump between arguments of the inner-product like
[tex]\langle H_i X, H_j X \rangle = \langle H_i X X^\dagger, H_j \rangle = \langle H_i, H_j \rangle[/tex]

However, I'm really concerned about doing this, for two reasons. The first is that normally, the notion of unitarity requires that we work the inner product defined as an operator on a space and its dual. In this case, the inner-product is on two copies of [itex]T_X G[/itex]. Since the metric is everywhere defined, I suppose we could say that G is a Riemannian manifold, in which case the musical isomorphisms give us a way of relating [itex]T_X^*G[/itex] to [itex]T_XG[/itex] and then it would be fine.

The second reason is "what is unitarity when we change the inner product?" In particular, we know what unitarity is for finite dimensions and [itex]L^2[/itex], but what does it mean on a Lie algebra? Does it make sense to have unitary operators on the space of skew-Hermitian matrices?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Should I perhaps be using the Killing form for my inner-product?
 
Kreizhn said:
Should I perhaps be using the Killing form for my inner-product?

Maybe. The Killing form is the (2,0) tensor that actually has a direct relation with the Lie algebra. But the Killing form isn't necessarily nondegenerate and it's certainly not positive definite. I'm a little puzzled what this is actually about.
 
I might be making this more complicated than it has to be.

Essentially, I'm saying that we have an orthonormal basis for the Lie algebra. I want to show that the right-translate of those basis elements also forms an orthonormal basis in general.

I'm not sure if it can be done in general. I was hoping that maybe by specifying that the Lie group is [itex]\mathfrak U(N)[/itex] and maybe using the (negative) Killing-form for a metric? Because finite dimensional unitaries form a compact group, the Killing-form would be negative-definite.

To make matters worse, while I've presented the problem in a Lie-group, Riemannian geometry framework, I actually want to consider the problem in a sub-Riemannian geometry However, since the Riemannian case is easier, I figure I should do that first.
 
Beats me. In the Riemannian case you've got an inner product and a notion of parallel transport, which let's you move vectors around in a way that's generally path dependent. Subriemannian, I don't know.
 
But can we show that orthonormality is preserved in the Riemannian case?
 
Kreizhn said:
But can we show that orthonormality is preserved in the Riemannian case?

Sure. Parallel transport is an isometry, isn't it?
 
Um...I'm really not certain. Intuitively it seems like it should be, so I'll look into it. Even so, doesn't that just preserve the normality? Wouldn't we need it to also be "conformal," if that even makes sense in this framework. Would it be forced to be conformal? Let me look into these questions and I'll get back to you.

Edit: I realize now that because the isometry would have to preserve the induced metric, we don't need a notion of conformality.

Second Edit: I clearly should brush up on my Riemannian geometry, as for whatever reason I was working with a metric space definition of isometry rather than one which preserves the metric tensor.
 
Last edited:
Well that was quick. It seems that so long as we use the Levi-Cevita connection then everything is okay. I don't see a problem with restricting ourselves to that connection.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 43 ·
2
Replies
43
Views
5K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
4K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
4K
Replies
6
Views
2K
Replies
2
Views
6K