Science Fair Project: Diffusing Water Through a Magnet

AI Thread Summary
The discussion centers on an experimental setup involving two containers separated by a selectively permeable membrane. One container holds pure water, while the other contains water mixed with a negatively charged solute. The experiment aims to utilize a negatively charged magnet positioned above the second container to filter out the negative solute as water diffuses across the membrane, potentially creating a perpetual energy flow by harnessing the kinetic energy of the falling water. However, participants point out that creating a perpetual motion machine is impossible due to the laws of thermodynamics, particularly concerning entropy and energy loss as heat and sound. Questions arise about the nature of the solute and the effectiveness of the magnet, with suggestions to clarify the experiment's mechanics and improve understanding through visual aids. Additionally, there is curiosity about the behavior of ferrofluid in magnetic fields and its potential interaction with water. Overall, the experiment faces fundamental challenges related to energy conservation and the properties of materials involved.
mfeneley
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Two containers are connected, divided by a selectively permeable membrane. The continer on the left contains pure water. The container on the right contains water and a negatively charged solute. The container on the right is angeled vertically so that when the water diffuses across the membrane the water level will rise. At the top of the container is a magnet which is also negatively charged. I am predicting that the magnet will filter the negative molecule out of the water as it rises. However, I suspect their will be an issue concerning entropy. Anyway, if all goes to plan the water that was purified by the magnet will leave the container through a spillway. The kinetic energy from the falling water will be harnesed by a wheel. After the energy is harnesed the water is redirected back into the the container with the pure water. Hypothetically this creates a constant flow of energy which is impossible. Whats wrong with this? Please critique and give some ideas on how to improve the experiment. My written explination may be hard to understand and I am going to try and insert a picture to help.
 
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mfeneley said:
Two containers are connected, divided by a selectively permeable membrane. The continer on the left contains pure water. The container on the right contains water and a negatively charged solute. The container on the right is angeled vertically so that when the water diffuses across the membrane the water level will rise. At the top of the container is a magnet which is also negatively charged. I am predicting that the magnet will filter the negative molecule out of the water as it rises. However, I suspect their will be an issue concerning entropy. Anyway, if all goes to plan the water that was purified by the magnet will leave the container through a spillway. The kinetic energy from the falling water will be harnesed by a wheel. After the energy is harnesed the water is redirected back into the the container with the pure water. Hypothetically this creates a constant flow of energy which is impossible. Whats wrong with this? Please critique and give some ideas on how to improve the experiment. My written explination may be hard to understand and I am going to try and insert a picture to help.

As you suspect, it is not possible for the perpetual motion machine to run. Yes, if you could post a sketch, that would help us point out the problem.
 
A picture would help. Also, you said a negatively charged magnet will filter out the negative molecules. Did you mean a positive magnet?
 
What is a "negatively charged solute"?

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How do I put a picture up?
 
mfeneley said:
How do I put a picture up?

If you have a picture on Photoshack or other hosting website, you can link to it here. Or you can attach PDF or JPG files in the Reply dialog page.
 
Quick question before I put my picture up. Is ferrofluid repelled by a magnet? If it is can it be mixed in water?
 
Forget that. Would water combined with solid bismouth cause pure water to pass through a selectively permeable membrane.
 
But energy is loss in the form of heat and sound. So no it won't create a constant flow.
 
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