Scrap Steel Refining: Separating Metals for New Steel

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the refining process of scrap steel for the production of new steel alloys, specifically focusing on how various metallic additives in scrap steel are separated to meet strict specifications for alloys like 4140. The scope includes theoretical and practical aspects of metal separation in recycling processes.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Technical explanation, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that recycled scrap steel is a mixture of various types of steel, each containing different proportions of alloying metals such as manganese, vanadium, and chromium.
  • There is a question about how to separate these alloying agents from the scrap melt to produce a specific steel alloy, such as 4140, which requires precise amounts of these metals.
  • One participant mentions that separation or sorting by type of steel is done manually and that some impurities can be removed by electrolysis during the melt.
  • Another participant expresses surprise at the elemental analysis performed by scrap recyclers, indicating a belief that they only separate ferrous from non-ferrous materials.
  • A later reply questions whether there are any chemical or physical methods available to separate the components of a steel alloy, suggesting skepticism about the feasibility of such separation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that separating alloying metals from scrap steel is necessary for producing specific steel alloys, but there is no consensus on the methods available for achieving this separation. Multiple competing views and uncertainties remain regarding the effectiveness and feasibility of various separation techniques.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on definitions of alloying agents and the unresolved nature of the methods for separating these components from scrap steel.

LAP3141
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A lot of scrap steel is recycled to make new steel. But how is this scrap steel refined?

Recycled scrap must be a mixture of various types of steel with each type containing different amounts of manganese, vanadium, chromium, etc. How are these other metals separated from the scrap melt so that new steels, such as 4140, which have a strict specification, be produced?

The carbon additives can be oxidized out, but I'm not sure how the metallic additives can be separated.
 
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Bystander said:
??

Perhaps you misunderstand the issue.

Steel is an alloy and the different types of steel contain different proportions of added metals such as manganese, molybdenum, vanadium, chromium, silicon, etc. Scrap steel must contain mixtures of different steel alloys and when this scrap steel is melted it will likely not be a match to any commercial alloy.

In order to make a specific steel alloy, such as 4140, a precise amount of added metals must be added to the melt. Thus, any scrap steel that is used to make 4140, or any other steel alloy, must first be purified by separating the alloying agents (molybdenum, vanadium, etc.).

How is this separation accomplished? How is the molybdenum, vanadium, chromium, silicon, etc. separated from the scrap steel melt to leave just pure iron?
 
jim mcnamara said:
Separation or sorting by type of steel = manual. Sometimes impurities (not alloying metals) are removed by electrolysis during the melt.
See: https://www.thermofisher.com/blog/metals/why-scrap-metal-recyclers-need-to-know-their-steels/

I did not realize that scrap recyclers performed elemental analysis on their product. I thought that they only separated ferrous from non-ferrous scrap and sent the all the ferrous material together to the mill as one big collection.

So manual sorting of the ferrous material based on a chemical analysis is the method used.

But one question still remains. Is there a chemical or physical method to separate the components of a steel alloy? I would tend to think that it's not possible to do so. That is, if we have 4140 steel, can the molybdemum, vanadium etc, be separated from the iron either chemicaly or physically?
 

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