Second book on special relativity

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around recommendations for advanced books on Special Relativity (SR) suitable for individuals seeking a deeper understanding after an initial exposure. Participants explore various texts, their content, and the transition from SR to General Relativity (GR), while also considering the mathematical rigor and conceptual depth of the suggested materials.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants inquire about the types of problems that advanced SR books would address, suggesting a need for clarity on the expected learning outcomes.
  • There is a suggestion that many second treatments of SR naturally lead into GR, emphasizing geometric interpretations and formal vector and tensor treatments.
  • One participant mentions a specific book, "Special relativity in general frames" by Éric Gourgoulhon, noting its depth but questioning its suitability as a second text.
  • Another participant recommends "Special Relativity" by Wolfgang Rindler and "Special Relativity: An Introduction with 200 Problems and Solutions" by Michael Tsamparlis as potential resources.
  • Discussion includes references to Dixon's book, with participants expressing interest in its advanced treatment and foundational perspectives on Newtonian and Minkowskian physics.
  • Some participants express a desire for more advanced texts that do not necessarily lead to GR, indicating a search for materials that delve deeper into SR without transitioning to GR.
  • There are mentions of the challenges in finding college courses that offer advanced SR, suggesting a gap in formal education on the subject.
  • One participant shares a personal interest in unifying physics formulations, indicating a desire for texts that explore foundational structures in a comprehensive manner.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on specific recommendations for a second exposure to SR, with multiple competing views on the suitability and focus of various texts. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best approach to advanced SR literature.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about the exact level of advancement in the recommended texts, and there is a recognition that many books may not fit neatly into the category of a "second" exposure to SR. The discussion highlights the variability in educational offerings related to SR and the challenges in identifying appropriate resources.

Frabjous
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What are the best books for a second exposure to Special Relativity? I can find plenty of threads on introductory books …
 
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What kind of problems would you expect this book to teach you to solve?
 
Mostly the same ones, but at a higher level of understanding.
 
caz said:
Mostly the same ones, but at a higher level of understanding.
My guess is that most second treatments of SR lead on to GR, with a focus on the geometric nature of the theory and a formal treatment of vectors and tensors. I like Sean Carroll's book (Spacetime Geometry) and this series of lectures from Professor Hughes at MIT:



Sean Carroll's notes are here:

https://arxiv.org/pdf/gr-qc/9712019.pdf
 
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PeroK said:
My guess is that most second treatments of SR lead on to GR, with a focus on the geometric nature of the theory and a formal treatment of vectors and tensors.
Making the jump to GR is an option. There are several threads on where to start with GR, so I would like to keep this thread focused on advanced SR refs unless the answer is GR.
 
caz said:
Making the jump to GR is an option. There are several threads on where to start with GR, so I would like to keep this thread focused on advanced SR unless the only answer is GR.
There's always:

https://itp.uni-frankfurt.de/~hees/pf-faq/srt.pdf
 
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caz said:
Mostly the same ones, but at a higher level of understanding.
That's pretty vague. It will be difficult to find a book to teach you something if you don't know exact;y what.

The flip answer is "find a college that teaches Special Relativity II and use their textbook". Howeverm you will find that there are few, if any, colleges that teach two terms of SR. Which gets us back to the question I asked.
 
Vanadium 50 said:
That's pretty vague. It will be difficult to find a book to teach you something if you don't know exact;y what.

The flip answer is "find a college that teaches Special Relativity II and use their textbook". Howeverm you will find that there are few, if any, colleges that teach two terms of SR. Which gets us back to the question I asked.
I already have a physics degree and I’m doing this for fun. I used French in school and have recently refreshed with Taylor and Wheeler. Looking at the most popular references, it seems like an underclassman could handle them. It made me wonder if there was something more advanced that wasn’t GR.

This isn‘t an effort to avoid GR. I’ve read Schutz and Carroll is on my to do list.
 
Look at a monograph "Special relativity in general frames" by Éric Gourgoulhon. It is a 800pgs gem, however I am afraid it's not a second, but at least the 4th text on SR.
 
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  • #10
caz said:
What are the best books for a second exposure to Special Relativity? I can find plenty of threads on introductory books …

Frimus said:
Look at a monograph "Special relativity in general frames" by Éric Gourgoulhon. It is a 800pgs gem, however I am afraid it's not a second, but at least the 4th text on SR.

This is a fantastic book, but I rarely recommend it to physics students or physicists. I only recommend this to people whom I know I are interested in the use of abstract math in theoretical physics.

Other options include "Special Relativity" by Wolfgang Rindler and "Special Relativity An Introduction with 200 Problems and Solutions" by Michael Tsamparlis.
 
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  • #12
I’ve seen a couple of interesting comments on Dixon’s book. Any thoughts on it?
 
  • #13
References to the Dixon comments?
Is it the Dixon book that discusses the foundations (along a certain approach) of Newtonian and Minkowskian physics in a similar way?
 
  • #14
I do not know how to quote old threads.

You wrote “Dixon's book is probably too specialized for his list... but, I agree, it is interesting. I've been browsing through it [mainly on the Newtonian limit] on and off for the past year“ in 2007 in response to “Dixon's "Special Relativity" is far more advanced and interesting than its title makes it sound (if that's what you want)” by Stingray who lists it elsewhere as his favorite SR book.

It is also one of Schutz’s additional reading SR references.
 
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  • #15
caz said:
I do not know how to quote old threads.

You wrote “Dixon's book is probably too specialized for his list... but, I agree, it is interesting. I've been browsing through it [mainly on the Newtonian limit] on and off for the past year“ in 2007 in response to “Dixon's "Special Relativity" is far more advanced and interesting than its title makes it sound (if that's what you want)” by Stingray who lists it elsewhere as his favorite SR book.

It is also one of Schutz’s additional reading SR references.
After a little digging, I think the reference is
https://www.physicsforums.com/threa...f-physics-and-math-texts.186748/#post-1442746

I haven’t looked in a while, but
I’ve been interested in works like this
because I am trying to find a more unified way to formulate physics so that it leads to usual Galilean physics in one case (infinite maximum signal speed) and Lorentz-invariant physics in the finite maximum signal speed case. (This is different from “small velocity limits”.)

Dixon would be good if you are interested in foundational structure…
but it’s not immediately applicable as other “next levels above introduction”
(which may deal with (say)
relativistic electromagnetism, more complicated situations (like Thomas precession or non-inertial kinematics), measurements by non-inertial frames, classical field theories, tensorial methods and their relationship to other methods (like 3-vectors), geometric interpretations, …
 
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  • #16
Another book at this level, I simply love, is

R. U. Sexl and H. K. Urbantke, Relativity, Groups, Particles, Springer, Wien (2001).
 
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