Shelf in a box, treating the shelf as a weak perturbation

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around treating a shelf as a weak perturbation in the context of quantum mechanics, specifically related to Hamiltonians and potential energy. The original poster expresses uncertainty about the definition of the perturbed state H' and the implications of the potential V(x) = Vo.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the definition of the perturbed Hamiltonian H' and discuss the implications of the shelf on the Hamiltonian. Questions arise regarding the necessary information to determine H' and the appropriate expressions for the wave functions in different scenarios.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the problem, with some clarifying the relationship between the Hamiltonian and the potential energy. There is a recognition of the need to derive H' based on the context provided, and some guidance has been offered regarding the integration of the potential over a finite region.

Contextual Notes

There is a noted lack of explicit information regarding the form of H' and the assumptions about the potential energy in the presence of the shelf. Participants are navigating these constraints while discussing the problem.

Futurestar33
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Homework Statement
Shelf in a box, treating the shelf as a weak perturbation. The pertubation is not given what should I use?
Relevant Equations
H= Ho+ H'
E_n = <Y_n|H'|Y_n>
In this problem I am supposed to treat the shelf as a weak perturbation. However it doesn't give us what the perturbed state H' is. At the step V(x) = Vo, but that is all that is given and isn't needed to determine H'.

This isn't in a weak magnetic field so I wouldn't you use H'=qEx and then treat X as an operator.

The other option I would use is H'=lamdaX, (but that is usually given in a problem as well)
 

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Futurestar33 said:
At the step V(x) = Vo, but that is all that is given and isn't needed to determine H'.
What do you mean? This is exactly what is needed to know ##H'##.

Start with the Hamiltonian in the absence of the shelf, then figure out how it is different if there is a shelf.
 
Im confused at this then.
When there is no shelf the H= ∇^2Ψ=-K^2Ψ where K= √(2mE)/hbar
General expression being Ψ= Csin(kx)+Dcos(kx) , k=npi/a

When there is a shelf H = ∇^2Ψ = -η^2Ψ where η=√(2mE-Vo)/hbar
General expression being Ψ= Ae^(κx)+Be^(-κx).

I know I am not supposed to plug those in for H'

are you saying I just use En = <Yn|H'| Yn> ==> <Yn| Vo |Yn> ?
 
Ok I got it, I was just thinking that usually it is given or some form of an operator.
but in this case it does just end up up being the above.
 
Futurestar33 said:
are you saying I just use En = <Yn|H'| Yn> ==> <Yn| Vo |Yn> ?
Yes. Remember that the Hamiltonian is kinetic energy + potential energy. This is not evident in the case of the particle in a box, because in the domain where the wave function is non-zero, the potential is zero.

##H'## is defined by parts, but calculating ##\langle \psi_n |H' | \psi_n \rangle## is easy since its an integration over a constant potential in a finite region of space.
 

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