Solve Grad x (grad x B) Equation

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the vector calculus identity involving the curl of a vector field, specifically the expression ∇x(∇xB) and its relation to other vector operations. The context is set within classical mechanics and potentially electrodynamics, as indicated by references to the magnetic field.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the validity of the original equation presented by the original poster, with some questioning the correctness of the problem statement itself. There are attempts to simplify both sides of the equation, and discussions about the implications of the terms involved.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing differing perspectives on the problem. Some have suggested that the original identity may be incorrect, while others are attempting to clarify the relationship between the terms involved. There is no explicit consensus, but guidance has been offered regarding the correct formulation of the identity.

Contextual Notes

Participants note potential confusion regarding the mixing of topics from mathematics and physics, particularly in relation to the context of the problem and the assumptions being made. There is also mention of the need for a foundational understanding of the concepts involved.

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Homework Statement



Show that:

∇x(∇xB) = (B∇)B - ∇ (1/2B2)

Homework Equations



r = (x,y,z) = xiei

∂xi/∂xj = δij

r2 = xkxk

δij = 1 if i=j, 0 otherwise (kronecker delta)
εijk is the alternating stress tensor and summn convn is assumed.

The Attempt at a Solution



On the LHS I simplified to get:

εijk2/∂xj∂xk

but was unsure what to do next because the RHS contains only first order derivatives

On the RHS I was able to get to:

(B∇)B - ∇ (1/2B2) = B(∂Bi/∂i)-B
= B(∂Bi/∂i-1)

I feel like I'm just not seeing some simple trick, or there is a rule that I don't remember/haven't learned. This is for my Classical Mechanics class BTW.
 
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There must be something wrong in your problem statement or how can you get an expression which is quadratic in [itex]\vec{B}[/itex] taking derivatives of an expression that contains only one [itex]\vec{B}[/itex]? The correct equation to prove is
[tex]\vec{\nabla} \times (\vec{\nabla} \times \vec{B})=\vec{\nabla} (\vec{\nabla} \cdot \vec{B}) - \vec{\nabla}^2 \vec{B},[/tex]
which holds, however, only in Cartesian coordinates!
 
that's what I was thinking, but the assignment is what I wrote above
 
(∇xB)xB = (B∇)B - ∇ (B²/2)

is famous in MHD
 
that's still not what I'm asking. but maybe showing a proof might help me out a bit
 
Showing a proof of what?
What are you asking, actually?
The original identity is obviously wrong (∇x(∇xB) = (B∇)B - ∇ (1/2B2) is wrong).
Shall we advise you to complain to your teacher?

The proof of the second identity, (∇xB)xB = (B∇)B - ∇ (B²/2), is straightforward by using components representation.

Using the notation "eik" for the Levi-Civita tensor,
using 'F,l" to denote the derivative of F with respect to xl,
(∇xB)xB can be developed as follows:

((∇xB)xB)i
= eijk (ejlm Bm,l) Bk
= - eikj elmj Bm,l Bk
= -(eil ekm - eim ekl) Bm,l Bk
= - Bk,i Bk + Bi,k Bk
= - (Bk²/2),i + Bi,k Bk

which ends the proof.

Reading you initial post:

"εijk is the alternating stress tensor ..."
"On the LHS I simplified to get: εijk∂2/∂xj∂xk"

I have the feeling you lack some basic understanding, since it makes almost no meaning.
I don't know if your question is part of a math course or a physics course (electrodynamics).
In any case, you need to go back to the basics.
The strange thing is that the identity "(∇xB)xB = (B∇)B - ∇ (B²/2)" is indeed related to the Maxwell stress tensor in electrodynamics (if B is the magnetic field). The second term is then called the magnetic pressure.
As you posted in the "Calculus & Beyond Homework" section I wonder how you could have mixed that "math exercise" with electrodynamics. Is Google the reason?
 
Last edited:

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