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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding a line integral problem related to potential functions in vector calculus. Participants are seeking clarification on the computation of a given potential function and the implications of certain mathematical properties and conventions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about how the author derived the potential function F(x,y) = axy + bx + cy + d, asking for clarification on the hint provided.
  • Another participant notes that if -∂F/∂x = h(y), then ∂²F/∂x² = 0, and mentions the equality of mixed partial derivatives.
  • A participant questions the negative sign in the expression -∂F/∂x = h(y) and seeks an explanation for this sign convention.
  • There is a repeated inquiry about the definition of potential F(x,y) in relation to the gradient, specifically whether it is defined as f = -∇F.
  • One participant suggests that the discrepancy in the definition of potential may be a matter of convention, noting that the mathematics remains consistent regardless of the chosen convention.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express uncertainty regarding the sign convention in the definition of potential functions and the implications of the mathematical properties discussed. There is no consensus on the correct interpretation of these conventions.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include potential misunderstandings of mathematical definitions and conventions, as well as the dependency on specific contexts or textbooks that may define terms differently.

WMDhamnekar
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TL;DR
Let g(x) and h(y) be differentiable functions, and let f(x, y) = h(y)i+ g(x)j. Can f have a potential F(x, y)? If so, find it.

You may assume that F would be smooth.
(Hint: Consider the mixed partial derivatives of F.)
I don't have any idea about how to use the hint given by the author.
Author has given the answer to this question i-e F(x,y) = axy + bx + cy +d.
I don't understand how did the author compute this answer.

Would any member of Physics Forums enlighten me in this regard?

Any math help will be accepted.
 
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Because
## - \dfrac{\partial F}{\partial x} = h(y) ##
then
## \dfrac{\partial^2 F}{\partial x^2} = 0 ##

And we also have
##\dfrac{\partial^2 F}{\partial x \partial y } = \dfrac{\partial^2 F}{\partial y \partial x } ##

If you just want to show that the potential exists, then show that ##\vec \nabla \times \vec f = 0 ##
 
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drmalawi said:
Because
## - \dfrac{\partial F}{\partial x} = h(y) ##
then
## \dfrac{\partial^2 F}{\partial x^2} = 0 ##

And we also have
##\dfrac{\partial^2 F}{\partial x \partial y } = \dfrac{\partial^2 F}{\partial y \partial x } ##
Why is the sign negative for ## \frac{\partial{F}}{\partial{x}}= h(y)?## Would you explain that ?
 
WMDhamnekar said:
Why is the sign negative for ## \frac{\partial{F}}{\partial{x}}= h(y)?## Would you explain that ?

Isn't the potential F(x,y) defined as ##\vec f = - \vec \nabla F## ?
 
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drmalawi said:
Isn't the potential F(x,y) defined as ##\vec f = - \vec \nabla F## ?
In the following corollary 4.6 ## \vec f \not= -\vec \nabla F ## Why?
1656595447021.png
 
WMDhamnekar said:
In the following corollary 4.6 ## \vec f \not= -\vec \nabla F ## Why?
View attachment 303550

Matter of convetion I guess, I have always used ##\vec f = - \vec \nabla F## as the definition as potential. But it does not matter, the math is the same, just follow your books conventions. And also -0 = 0 so...
 
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