Solving Coupled EDOs in Lagrangian Mechanics: Is it Feasible?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around solving coupled ordinary differential equations (ODEs) within the framework of Lagrangian mechanics, specifically for a rigid pendulum system. The original poster questions the feasibility of analytically solving the equations of motion given certain initial conditions without the small angle approximation.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to understand the solvability of the coupled ODEs and raises a question about the validity of the small angle approximation, particularly regarding the behavior of the angular velocity. Another participant presents a different ODE and suggests it is solvable, providing an integral expression as part of their reasoning.

Discussion Status

Participants are exploring different aspects of the problems. While one participant asserts that the second ODE is solvable and provides a mathematical expression, there is ongoing inquiry about the implications of the small angle approximation and how to invert a function related to the integral presented.

Contextual Notes

The original poster notes that the problem statement does not allow for the small angle approximation, which raises questions about the assumptions being made in the analysis. There is also a mention of constants in the second ODE that may affect the discussion.

quasar987
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I must solve the following two coupled EDOs in the context of a Lagrangian mechanics problem (a rigid pendulum of length l attached to a mass sliding w/o friction on the x axis). The problem statement does not mention that we can make small angle approximation. It says "find the equations of motion and solve them for the following initial conditions:...". Is this feasable?

[tex](m_1+m_2)\ddot{x}+m_2l\ddot{\theta}\cos(\theta)-m_2l\dot{\theta}^2\sin(\theta)=0[/tex]

[tex]l\ddot{\theta}+\ddot{x}\cos(\theta)+g\sin(\theta)=0[/tex]

They can be uncoupled but there remains a second order non-linear ODE to solve.

Is this doable analytically?

And an annexed question (perhaps this one is more of a physical nature): why can we say that [itex]\dot{\theta}\approx 0[/itex] in the small angle approximation? The angle can be small and nevertheless vary furiously fast. What indicates that if theta is small, the so is its derivative?
 
Last edited:
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Same question but with

[tex]\ddot{y}+ay+b\cos(y)=0[/tex]

Solvable? (a,b are constants)
 
The one in the second post is doable:

[tex]t+C_{2}=\int \frac{dy}{\sqrt{2C_{1}-ay^{2}-2b\sin y}}[/tex]

It remains to compute the integral.

Mathematica returns

[tex]\int \frac{dy}{\sqrt{2C_{1}-ay^{2}-2b\sin y}} =-\frac{2}{\sqrt{2C_{1}-ay^{2}-2b\sin y}} F\left[\frac{1}{4}\left(\pi -2y\right), \frac{4b}{-2C_{1}+ay^2 +2b}\right]\sqrt{\frac{2C_{1}-ay^{2}-2b\sin y}{2C_{1}-ay^{2}-2b}}[/tex]

Daniel.
 
Last edited:
So how do you inverse the function t?
 
By an appropriate use of Jacobi's elliptic functions. In this case i think sine amplitudinis.

Daniel.
 

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