Solving for Potential with Circular Harmonics & Legendre Polynomials

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter kthouz
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Circular Harmonics
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around solving for potential in two-dimensional polar coordinates using circular harmonics. Participants explore the applicability of Legendre polynomials and discuss various mathematical functions relevant to the problem, including Bessel functions and Gauss-Laguerre functions.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the use of Legendre polynomials in two-dimensional polar coordinates and seeks analogous functions.
  • Another participant suggests that circular harmonics can be represented by sine and cosine functions.
  • A different participant introduces the concept of circular harmonics as modified cosines, referencing external material for further reading.
  • One participant states that the Laplacian in polar coordinates leads to Bessel's equation, indicating that Bessel functions are relevant for circular geometries.
  • Another participant proposes that circular harmonics refer to Gauss-Laguerre functions, highlighting their properties and applications in circular geometries.
  • It is noted that Bessel and Neumann functions provide a basis for the radial equation in polar coordinates, with a specific form for the angular part being discussed.
  • One participant emphasizes that the solution for potential in two-dimensional polar coordinates does not involve Bessel functions but rather powers of the radial coordinate multiplied by sine and cosine functions.
  • The original poster reiterates their question about the use of Legendre polynomials and suggests Zernike polynomials as a possible alternative.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the appropriate functions to use for solving the potential in two-dimensional polar coordinates. There is no consensus on whether Legendre polynomials or other functions like Gauss-Laguerre or Zernike polynomials are suitable.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight the distinction between two-dimensional and three-dimensional solutions, indicating that assumptions about dimensionality may affect the applicability of certain functions.

kthouz
Messages
188
Reaction score
0
I have a problem consisting in solving for potential in 2 dim polar coordinates where I am asked to use circular harmonics. Can I still use Legendre polynomials (since these are actually for spherical harmonics)? If not what are their analoguous in polar coordinates?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
It sounds just like cos and sin to me.
 
Circular harmonics are discussed at <http://www.blackpawn.com/texts/ch/default.html>.
There they look like modified cosines.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
The Laplacian, in polar coordinates, reduces to Bessel's equation. Bessel functions are harmonics for two dimensional circles (or three dimensional cylinders).
 
I believe that "circular harmonics" refers to the Gauss-Laguerre functions defined by

GL_n(r) = L_n(r^2) exp(-r^2/2)

where L_n(x) is the nth Laguerre polynomial. (They are often denoted by a script L, but I don't know how to do that.) They turn up in descriptions of circular radar and laser beams. They constitute a complete orthogonal basis and have the very handy property that each is its own Hankel transform. They're distinctly different from both Legendre polynomials and Bessel functions, but they're useful for expanding potentials in circular geometries.
 
The Bessel and Neumann (or equivalently the Hankel) functions provide a basis for the radial equation, when separating the 2D Laplace equation in polar coordinates. For the angular part, which I'd identify with the analog of spherical harmonics in 2D are simply the orthonormal set of exponential functions

u_m(\varphi)=\frac{1}{\sqrt{2 \pi}} \exp(\mathrm{i} m \varphi), \quad m \in \mathbb{Z},

or, if you prefer real basis,

u_0(\varphi)=\frac{1}{\sqrt{2 \pi}}, \quad u_m^{(1)}(\varphi)=\cos(m \varphi), \quad u_m^{(2)}(\varphi) \sin(\varphi), \quad m \in \mathbb{N}_{&gt;0}.

The general solution of the Laplace equation in terms of the corresponding series reads

\phi(r,\varphi)=\sum_{m=-\infty}^{\infty} [\phi_m^{(1)} J_m(r/r_0) + \phi_m^{(2)} N_m(r/r_0)] u_m(\varphi).

This form with the Bessel and Neumann functions is convenient since J_m is the solution of the radial equation which is analytic in r=0, while N_m is singular at the origin.
 
The OP specifically said two-dimensional. The solution to the potential in two-dimensional polar coordinates is not Bessel functions (that is the solution to three-dimensional cylindrical coordinates) but us just powers of the radial coordinate times sines and cosines of the angular coordinate. In two-dimensions, circular harmonics are just sines and cosines in the angular coordinate with a single-valued condition applied (thus leading to harmonics).
See the end of http://faculty.uml.edu/cbaird/95.657%282011%29/EMLecture4.pdf" .
 
Last edited by a moderator:
kthouz said:
I have a problem consisting in solving for potential in 2 dim polar coordinates where I am asked to use circular harmonics. Can I still use Legendre polynomials (since these are actually for spherical harmonics)? If not what are their analoguous in polar coordinates?

Perhaps Zernike polynomials?
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
845
  • · Replies 58 ·
2
Replies
58
Views
8K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K