Solving Odd n x n Anti-Symmetric Matrices | Using Theorem 3.5

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the properties of anti-symmetric matrices, specifically focusing on the determinant of an n x n anti-symmetric matrix when n is odd. The original poster presents a specific case of a 3x3 anti-symmetric matrix and seeks to generalize the findings to any odd dimension.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the relationship between the determinant of a matrix and its transpose, as well as the implications of multiplying rows by -1. There is discussion on how these properties lead to the conclusion about the determinant being zero for odd n.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively engaging with the problem, providing hints and guiding questions. There is a clear exploration of the implications of the determinant properties, but no consensus has been reached on the final conclusion. The discussion includes playful banter, indicating a friendly atmosphere while focusing on the mathematical concepts.

Contextual Notes

Some participants question the assumptions made about the properties of determinants and the implications of odd dimensions, while others reference specific theorems and properties without providing a complete resolution to the problem.

DWill
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Homework Statement


An n x n matrix A is anti-symmetric if it satis fies the equation A^t = -A.
Show that if n is odd and A is anti-symmetric, then det(A) = 0. (Hint: carefully
use Theorem 3.5 on page 187.)


Homework Equations


Theorem 3.5: If B is obtained from A by multiplying a row (column) of A by a real number c, then det(B) = c det(A).

A^t = inverse of A


The Attempt at a Solution


I found the general 3x3 antisymmetric matrix to look like this:

[
0 a_12 a_13
-a_12 0 a_23
-a_13 -a_23 0
]

To find the determinant I just used the method of left and right diagonals since the matrix is 3x3, and I find it to be 0. BUT I don't know how to show this for any n x n matrix with n being odd (so it can be 5x5, 7x7, etc). I don't know where to use the theorem given in the hint either. Please help! Thanks
 
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Forget the specific dimension. You had better know that det(A)=det(A^t). Do you? If so, that tells you that det(A)=det(A^t)=det(-A). You can get -A from A by multiplying each row of A by -1, one at a time. Now what? Remember the number of row is odd.
 
I see, I get to this point:

det(-A) = (-1)^n * det(A)

I'm not sure where to go from there though. For an odd n det(-A) will be negative of det(A), how does this show det(A) = 0? thanks
 
DWill said:
For an odd n det(-A) will be negative of det(A), how does this show det(A) = 0? thanks

If I told you that [itex]x=-x[/itex], would you be able to tell me what [itex]x[/itex] was?:wink:

P.S. You wouldn't happen to be a Utah Jazz fan would you ? :smile:
 
If you've got det(A^t)=det(A) and det(A^t)=det(-A) and det(-A)=(-1)^n*det(A), and you know (-1)^n=(-1), then you have det(A)=-det(A), right? Chain them all together. For what real number is x=(-x)? There's only one.
 
gabbagabbahey said:
If I told you that [itex]x=-x[/itex], would you be able to tell me what [itex]x[/itex] was?:wink:

P.S. You wouldn't happen to be a Utah Jazz fan would you ? :smile:

Utah Jazz? I give up. I'm a sports ignoramus. Basketball player? Dwill? Am I getting close?
 
Dick said:
Utah Jazz? I give up. I'm a sports ignoramus. Basketball player? Dwill? Am I getting close?

D-Will is the Nickname for Deron Williams; one of the best point guards (yes, that's basketball) in the NBA and a member of this years Gold medal winning US Olympic squad :smile:
 
From Dick's hint you can say something about det(A^t), and from the given information, you can say something about (-1)^n.
 
I feel proud I knew it was basketball. Good thing this isn't the Sports Forum. I won't ask what a "point guard" is.
 
  • #10
Haha wow I should've seen that one. :(

And gabba yes I am a Deron Williams fan, though not a Jazz fan. :) I don't hate them or anything, just neutral. I am actually rooting for Houston, and I can't wait to see the first game between them and the Jazz this year after being eliminated by them last few years. Utah also seems to have a thing against Ron Artest, so that will be fun to watch too. :)

Anyways, thanks a lot for the help, unfortunately I'll probably have many more questions to come since I'm really trying to catch up in my Linear Algebra class right now.
 
  • #11
Watch less basketball. Do more linear algebra. Wouldn't that be more fun? Just kidding.
 
  • #12
I'm a Raptors fan myself, but You've got to respect a guy with Deron's talents...I was pretty big on Houston coming into the season, but after watching them get killed by the Lakers in the 4th quarter the other night, I think it's safe to say that they have an outside shot at best of getting to the finals.
 
  • #13
I'm outta here.
 
  • #14
Dick said:
Watch less basketball. Do more linear algebra. Wouldn't that be more fun? Just kidding.

A healthy dose of both is my prescription :smile: (And playing basketball is even better)
 
  • #15
Absolutement.
 

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