Solving the EM field equations to produce the desired vector field

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around solving the electromagnetic field equations to derive the vector fields F and G from the magnetic vector potential A, focusing on the implications of the Lorenz gauge condition and the potential need for numerical methods versus analytical solutions.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests starting with the magnetic vector potential A and applying the Lorenz gauge condition to derive the vector fields F and G.
  • Another participant emphasizes the importance of boundary conditions, noting that the fields should drop to zero at infinity.
  • There is a discussion about whether an analytical solution is feasible for arbitrary potentials, with some participants expressing skepticism about the possibility of finding a solution for every potential.
  • A participant introduces the Helmholtz theorem and proposes substitutions for F and G that lead to Poisson's equations, suggesting that these equations can be solved to find the auxiliary fields F' and G'.
  • Some participants mention that while there may be analytical solutions involving integrals of the divergence or curl of A, numerical methods might be necessary for practical integration.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the feasibility of analytical solutions for arbitrary potentials, with some indicating that numerical methods may be required. There is no consensus on the best approach to solving the equations.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes assumptions about the nature of the potentials and the conditions under which solutions are sought, such as the requirement for boundary conditions and the implications of the Lorenz gauge condition.

greswd
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TL;DR
I have a set of equations which represent conditions that the desired solution vector field has to meet.
So, we have A, the magnetic vector potential, and its divergence is the Lorenz gauge condition.

I want to solve for the two vector fields of F and G, and I'm wondering how I should begin##\nabla \cdot \mathbf{F}=-\nabla \cdot\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\mathbf{A} =-\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\left ( \nabla \cdot \mathbf{A} \right )##

##\nabla \times \mathbf{F} = 0##

##\nabla \cdot \mathbf{G} = 0##

##\nabla \times \mathbf{G} = \nabla \times\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\mathbf{A} =\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\left ( \nabla \times \mathbf{A} \right )##Also, solving for one of them, solving either F or G, is good enough :smile:
 
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Probably numerically. And I noticed you never used the words "boundary conditions". They are important.
 
Vanadium 50 said:
Probably numerically. And I noticed you never used the words "boundary conditions". They are important.

ahh yeah, for EM I guess it'd have to drop to zero at infinity

so you think an analytical solution might be out of reach?
 
For an arbitrary potential? For every single potential? Probably not.
 
Vanadium 50 said:
For an arbitrary potential? For every single potential? Probably not.
does this mean like every single potential which is Lorenz gauged
 
Ok I guess ##\mathbf{A}## is given and is known and you want to find ##\mathbf{F}## or ##\mathbf{G}## in terms of ##\mathbf{A}##.

Have you heard of the fundamental theorem of vector calculus, also known as Helmholtz theorem?

If not, then use the substitution $$\mathbf{F}=\nabla F' (1)$$ then equation##\nabla\times\mathbf{F}=0## is automatically satisfied (because the curl of the gradient is zero) and the second equation will lead you to Poisson's equation which you probably know how to solve.

Similarly for G, use the substitution $$\mathbf{G}=\nabla\times\mathbf{G'} (2)$$ and then the condition ##\nabla\cdot G=0## is satisfied (because the divergence of a curl is always zero) and the second equation will lead you to 3 Poisson's equations, one for each component of ##\mathbf{G'}##. You will also need the condition that ##\nabla\cdot\mathbf{G'}=0## and the identity ##\nabla\times(\nabla\times \mathbf{G'})=\nabla^2\mathbf{G'}-\nabla(\nabla\cdot\mathbf{G'})##

I am almost confident that you know the general solution to Poisson's equation (with the boundary condition that the field/potential is zero at infinity).

Once you find the scalar field ##F'## and the vector field ##\mathbf{G'}## as solutions to Poisson's, use (1) and (2) to compute ##\mathbf{F}## and ##\mathbf{G}##.
 
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Vanadium 50 said:
For an arbitrary potential? For every single potential? Probably not.
There is analytical solution in terms of an integral of the divergence or curl of A, but yes if A is really given and want to perform the integration you might need numerical methods.
 
Delta2 said:
There is analytical solution in terms of an integral of the divergence or curl of A, but yes if A is really given and want to perform the integration you might need numerical methods.

oh nice, i would like a general solution
 
greswd said:
oh nice, i would like a general solution
Did you read my post #6? That is to define the auxiliary fields ##F',\mathbf{G'}## and solve for those first as solutions to Poisson's equation...
 

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