Space of matrices with non-zero determinant

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the density of the space of 2x2 matrices with non-zero determinant within the space of all 2x2 matrices. Participants explore various approaches to proving this property, including considerations of matrix perturbations and determinants.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks to prove that the space of 2x2 matrices with non-zero determinant is dense, having already established that it is an open set.
  • Another participant asserts that the space in question is not dense or open, but rather closed with empty interior, suggesting that its complement is open and dense.
  • There is a discussion about the determinant of a perturbed matrix ##M_\epsilon = M + \epsilon I##, with one participant proposing this as a method to show density.
  • Concerns are raised about specific cases where the determinant might be zero, particularly for matrices of the form ##\begin{pmatrix} -\epsilon & 0\\ 0 & -\epsilon \end{pmatrix}##.
  • Clarifications are made regarding the nature of ##\epsilon##, with participants discussing it as an arbitrary positive real number.
  • One participant provides a detailed breakdown of the determinant of ##M + \epsilon I## and poses exercises to explore different cases of determinants being zero or non-zero.
  • Another participant expresses understanding and readiness to write up the proof after the discussion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the initial claim regarding the density of the space of matrices with non-zero determinant, with conflicting views presented about its properties.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the discussion hinges on the behavior of determinants under perturbations and the specific conditions under which they may or may not be zero. There are unresolved mathematical steps regarding the implications of the determinant being zero or non-zero for various cases.

brunob
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Hi there!
How can I prove that the space of matrices (2x2) nonzero determinant is dense in the space of matrices (2x2) ?

I've already proved that it's an open set.
Thanks.

PD: Sorry about the mistake in the title.
 
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The space you named isn't dense or open. In fact, it's closed with empty interior, i.e. its complement is open and dense.

[For any people reading, the named space has since changed. Now it is open and dense.]
 
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Sorry, you're right it's not the matrices with determinant = 0, I should say nonzero determinant.

Thanks!
 
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There are lots of different ways you could show it. One would be to consider, for any matrix ##M## and small nonzero number ##\epsilon## the nearby matrix ##M_\epsilon = M + \epsilon I##. What is the determinant of ##M_\epsilon##? Can you show it's nonzero for small but nonzero ##\epsilon##?
 
The determinant of M_\epsilon is always nonzero. Unless M = \begin{pmatrix} -\epsilon & 0\\ 0 & -\epsilon \end{pmatrix}.
Is \epsilon fixed or just a number decreasing to zero?
 
brunob said:
The determinant of M_\epsilon is always nonzero. Unless M = \begin{pmatrix} -\epsilon & 0\\ 0 & -\epsilon \end{pmatrix}.
Is \epsilon fixed or just a number decreasing to zero?
I'm pretty sure numbers never decrease. :wink: But ##\epsilon## is an arbitrary positive real number here, so it could certainly be an arbitrary term in a decreasing sequence that converges to 0.

Since ##\epsilon## is a number you choose, the possibility that M is that specific matrix is not a concern. (If M is that matrix, just change your choice of ##\epsilon##).

What you need to show is that for all 2×2 matrices M and all ##\varepsilon>0##, there's a 2×2 matrix M' with non-zero determinant such that ##d(M',M)<\varepsilon##. I guess the idea here is that if you choose a small enough ##t>0## and define ##M'=M+tI##, then we will have ##d(M',M)<\varepsilon##. (I haven't tried it, and I'm going to bed now).

(economicsnerd's ##\epsilon## is my t).
 
Fix your matrix ##M = \begin{pmatrix} a & b\\ c & d \end{pmatrix}##, and notice that ##M+\epsilon I \longrightarrow M## as ##\epsilon \longrightarrow 0##.

If we can show that the determinant of ##M+\epsilon I## is nonzero for small enough nonzero ##\epsilon##, then we know that matrices with nonzero determinant are dense.* So let's show it.

The determinant of ##M+\epsilon I## is just ##(a+\epsilon)(d+\epsilon) - bc##, which equals (ad-bc) + (a+d)\epsilon + \epsilon^2

-Exercise: If ##ad-bc\neq 0##, then ##(ad-bc) + (a+d)\epsilon + \epsilon^2\neq 0## for small enough nonzero ##\epsilon##. (Though you don't really need to do this one, since ##ad-bc\neq 0## means ##M## already has nonzero determinant.)
-Exercise: If ##ad-bc=0## but ##a+d\neq 0##, then ##(ad-bc) + (a+d)\epsilon + \epsilon^2\neq 0## for small enough nonzero ##\epsilon##.
-Exercise: If ##ad-bc= a+d = 0##, then ##(ad-bc) + (a+d)\epsilon + \epsilon^2\neq 0## for small enough nonzero ##\epsilon##. (This one is basically immediate.)

*[Indeed, for some ##n\in\mathbb N##, we would know ##M+\frac1k I## has nonzero determinant for every ##k\geq n##. Then ##(M+\frac1k I)_{k=n}^\infty## is a sequence of matrices with nonzero determinant, converging to ##M##.]
 
Great, got it! I'll write it.

Thank you so much!
 

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