Special relativity in Lagrangian and Hamiltonian language

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around recommendations for books that introduce Lagrangian and Hamiltonian mechanics within the context of special relativity. Participants express interest in resources that highlight the relationship between these frameworks and classical mechanics, including topics like Noether's theorem.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants seek recommendations for books that cover Lagrangian and Hamiltonian mechanics in a special relativity context, emphasizing the need for mathematical formalism.
  • One participant mentions Susskind's "Special Relativity and Classical Field Theory" as a potential resource.
  • Another participant suggests "Special Relativity in General Frames" by Eric Gourgoulhon, particularly chapter 11 on the "Principle of Least Action," suitable for graduate students.
  • Several titles are proposed, including "Lagrangian Interaction" by Doughty, "Foundations of Mechanics" by Abraham and Marsden, and "Classical Dynamics: A Contemporary Approach" by Jose and Saletan.
  • Additional resources include "Analytical Mechanics for Relativity and Quantum Mechanics" and various papers discussing the derivation of the relativistic Lagrangian and Hamiltonian dynamics.
  • One participant shares a link to their attempt at explaining special relativity with action-principle arguments in a Lagrangian framework.
  • Another participant notes that concise treatments can be found in quantum field theory textbooks, mentioning Peskin & Schroeder and Landau & Lifshitz as examples.
  • There is a request for more elementary treatments, with a participant asking about the level of physics math studied by others.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the need for resources that connect Lagrangian and Hamiltonian mechanics with special relativity, but there are multiple competing views on which specific texts or approaches are most suitable. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best recommendations for different levels of understanding.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express a desire for resources that start from a coordinate-free mathematical formalism, indicating a potential limitation in the available recommendations. The discussion also reflects varying levels of familiarity with the subject matter among participants.

lriuui0x0
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Some introduction books on Lagrangian and Hamiltonian mechanics use classical mechanics as the theoretical framework, and when it come to special relativity it goes back to the basics and force language again. I would like to ask for some recommendations on good books that introduces Lagrangian and Hamiltonian mechanics in the special relativity settings, especially some notes on their relationship with the classical mechanics counterpart would be great! E.g. Neother's theorem in special relativity.
 
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There is Susskind's Special Relativity and Classical Field Theory.
 
lriuui0x0 said:
I would like to ask for some recommendations on good books that introduces Lagrangian and Hamiltonian mechanics in the special relativity settings, especially some notes on their relationship with the classical mechanics counterpart would be great! E.g. Neother's theorem in special relativity.
At what level? At the graduate student level, there is chapter 11 "Principle of Least Action" from the beautiful book "Special Relativity in General Frames" by Eric Gourgoulhon.
 
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George Jones said:
At what level? At the graduate student level, there is chapter 11 "Principle of Least Action" from the beautiful book "Special Relativity in General Frames" by Eric Gourgoulhon.
That's a really good recommendation! I wonder if there're classical mechanics books that follows a similar philosophy? E.g. starting from a mathematical formulism in coordinate free language.

PeroK said:
There is Susskind's Special Relativity and Classical Field Theory.
Thanks! I watched Susskind's lectures before but I'm looking for something with a bit more mathematical formalism.
 
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Analytical Mechanics for Relativity and Quantum Mechanics​

https://www.amazon.com/dp/0198766807/?tag=pfamazon01-20Of possible interest

  • A direct derivation of the relativistic Lagrangian for a system of particles using d'Alembert's principle

https://aapt.scitation.org/doi/10.1119/1.4885349

Hamiltonian dynamics on the symplectic extended phase space for autonomous and non-autonomous systems​

https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/0305-4470/38/6/006

https://web-docs.gsi.de/~struck/hp/hamilton/hamilton2.pdf
 
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Interestingly, the most concise and elegant treatments I know come from QFT textbooks. This is useful only if you are already familiar with calculus of variations.

Example: Peskin & schroeder section 2.2
http://www.fulviofrisone.com/attachments/article/483/Peskin, Schroesder - An introduction To Quantum Field Theory(T).pdf

At a more elementary level, Landau Lifshitz vol. 2 (also available free online) treats relativity very well starting from the lagrangian perspective, section 8.
http://fulviofrisone.com/attachments/article/209/Landau L.D. Lifschitz E.M.- Vol. 2 - The Classical Theory of Fields.pdf

For more elementary treatments I don't quite have a good reference unfortunately. Maybe you can tell use how much physics math you have studied (undergrad physics degree?). Landau vol.2 can be understood if you have the equivalent of vol. 1 (undergrad level classical mechanics).
 
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