Spectroscopy: What Do I See When I Combine Red & Green Beams?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the observation and interpretation of spectra when combining monochromatic red and green light beams. Participants explore the expected outcomes when these beams are analyzed using a spectroscope, considering both linear and nonlinear responses of the system.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that combining red and green beams results in a yellow beam, which may show a spectrum containing red, green, yellow, and potentially other frequency bands due to harmonic generation.
  • Another participant argues that a linear spectroscope would only display the red and green lines, asserting that nonlinear responses are necessary to produce additional frequencies.
  • A third participant agrees with the need for a nonlinear medium to generate new frequencies and references external material on frequency generation.
  • One participant suggests that a spectroscope performs a Fourier Transform, questioning whether a linear combination of red and green light could yield anything other than red and green in the spectrum.
  • A participant discusses the human eye's perception of color, noting that both monochromatic yellow light and the combination of red and green light excite similar color sensors, leading to the same visual perception.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the outcomes of combining red and green light in a spectroscopic analysis. While some assert that only red and green will be observed in a linear system, others suggest that nonlinear effects could introduce additional spectral components. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the exact nature of the observed spectrum.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference the linearity of the spectroscope and the nonlinear response of the human eye, indicating that the outcomes may depend on the specific characteristics of the systems involved. There is also mention of mathematical identities related to the combination of frequencies, which may not be fully explored in the discussion.

MaWM
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I have two monochromatic beams, one green, one red. I combine the beams together and get a single yellow beam. I pass the yellow beam through a spectroscope and determine its spectrum. What do I see?

A red band and a green band? A yellow band?

I suspect that what I'd see is: A green band, a red band, a yellow band, a very low frequency band that is a carrier for the yellow, and other weaker bands that represent higher harmonics of the red+green combination. Can anyone confirm this?

By the way, the low frequency carrier that I am suspecting will appear comes from the sum-to-product trig identity. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_trigonometric_identities" The sum of the green and red cause a product of a yellow and a low frequency envelope.
 
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If your spectroscope is a linear system (which it should be!) then you will just get two lines, red and green.

The only way you can get anything else is if something in the system has a nonlinear response. For a nonlinear system, an input (A sin w1 t + B sin w2 t) can produce output including terms like (C sin w1 t + D sin w2 t)^2.

That squared term contains a term like E sin w1t sin w2t which (using your trig identity) is equivalent to two waves at new frequencies, F sin (w1+w2)t + G sin (w1-w2)t

Your eyes and brain are a nonlinear system for analysing light waves. That's why you see "red+green" as yellow, and you also see monochromatic yellow light as yellow.

A good spectroscope should be almost perfectly linear, so the constants C D E F and G will be very small compared with A and B and you will get just two lines in the spectrum, red and green.
 
Alephzero is correct, you need a medium with a nonlinear response to generate new frequencies.

http://www.rp-photonics.com/sum__and_difference_frequency_generation.html

Claude.
 
So, a good spectroscope essentially performs a Fourier Transform on the incoming signal. And, because of the uniqueness of the Fourier Transform, a linear combination of red and green will never give anything besides red and green?

But its our eye that somehow aliases the signal..
 
My biology knowledge is pretty basic but AFAIK human eyes have three color sensor systems (for red green and blue) which have a fairly broad bandwith. If monochromatic yellow light excites both the red and green sensors, or monochromatic red+green causes the same output, the brain doesn't know the difference and they both "look the same".

Correct, a good spectroscope essentially does an FFT.
 

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