Speed and distance in a car crash

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the physics of a car crash, specifically focusing on calculating the speed required to move another vehicle sideways during a collision. Participants explore the application of physics principles such as momentum and friction in the context of a legal case related to a car accident.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks formulas and explanations to demonstrate the speed needed to move another vehicle sideways after a collision.
  • Another participant provides a calculation using coefficients of friction and conservation of momentum, suggesting that a speed of 25 MPH would result in approximately 27 cm of lateral movement, while higher speeds yield similar results.
  • Concerns are raised about the assumptions made in the calculations, particularly regarding the distribution of weight and the effectiveness of the reasoning in a courtroom setting.
  • There is a discussion about the potential fault in the accident, depending on the actions of both drivers, and the importance of expert testimony in legal situations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the effectiveness of physics calculations in court, with some suggesting that such reasoning may not impress a judge, while others emphasize the need for expert testimony to support claims.

Contextual Notes

Participants note several assumptions in the calculations, including the distribution of weight on the vehicles and the conditions of the road. The discussion does not resolve these assumptions or the implications they may have on the calculations presented.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for individuals involved in legal cases related to car accidents, particularly those interested in the physics of collisions and the role of expert testimony in court proceedings.

elijahfischer
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I had a car accident and need to go to court to prove my case. Please help me figure this out with what formulas I need to use. Also please explain details so I can explain it to the judge. Thanks. Here it is: I was traveling when I hit a car that pulled out in front of me. She claims she was making a left turn and that I hit her vehicle on the corner hard enough to push her vehicle sideways. I need to know how fast I would need to be going to move the back of her vehicle sideways anything more than an 1".
Here is the data:
Weight of my vehicle: 3196 lbs
Weight of her vehicle: 3009 lbs
My speed before impact: 25 MPH
Her speed before impact: o mph
Payment: Asphalt
Weather conditions: Dry 70 degree F
 
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Jones and Childers report coefficients of friction of about µ=0.7 for dry roads

The force opposing motion would be µW=(M+W)a: W is the weight of her car and M is the weight of yours - a is the deceleration. the distance slid is given by d=v²/2a where v is the initial speed of both cars.

Back of envelope, you'd use conservation of momentum to estimate the speed of both vehicles together after the collision but before lateral movement.

Mu=(M+W)v where u is the speed of your car before the impact.

Plugging in the numbers I get 27cm lateral movement: about a foot.
There's an awful lot of assumptions in that but at least it does not look all that sensitive to even quite large changes in speed (I still get less than a foot for u=50mph).
That's for pushing the whole car - for just the back you'd be rotating about the front wheels and only the weight on the back wheels will count for F. If I guess half (it will be less - engine is in the front right?) and just stay linear the guess turns into 72cm - a bit over two feet.

However: my experience is that judges are seldom impressed by this sort of reasoning unless you get an expert witness to deliver it. What you really need is an expert in accidents or a practical experiment.
 
If she attempted a left turn from opposing traffic or from a side street while it was not safe to do so would mean that her manoeuvre was the probable cause of the accident.
If you rear-ended her then most likely your inattention on the road that is the probable cause of the accident. Unless she changed lanes and braked in front of you and you hit her in which case the main party at fault is for a debate.
Unless you can prove to the judge that you are an expert in some aspect of road collisions and damage ensued, I doubt that a momentum and energy calculation would impress the judge, as SB stated.
 
Thanks for the help. Will keep that in mind about want impresses the judges.
 

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