Speed of sound versus frequency

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on whether the speed of sound is dependent on its frequency, considering identical conditions in the medium. Participants explore theoretical and practical implications of this relationship.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the speed of sound does not depend on frequency, stating that the speed is determined by the elastic and inertial properties of the medium, while frequency is set by the oscillating body.
  • One participant references a wiki quote suggesting that the speed of sound can vary with frequency due to non-adiabatic responses of the medium, raising questions about the applicability of this claim.
  • Another participant discusses the concept of adiabatic processes and suggests that in air at room temperature, sound waves behave nearly adiabatically, which supports the idea that speed does not vary with frequency.
  • There is mention of the relationship between pressure, volume, and the adiabatic constant (γ), with a focus on how this relates to the speed of sound in air and its theoretical predictions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between speed of sound and frequency, with some asserting a definitive no and others introducing conditions under which the speed might vary. The discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the discussion is influenced by the assumptions regarding adiabatic versus non-adiabatic processes and the specific properties of the medium being considered.

pixel01
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My question is : does the speed of sound depend on its frequency?
All other medium conditions considered identical.
 
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pixel01 said:
My question is : does the speed of sound depend on its frequency?
All other medium conditions considered identical.
No. The frequency is set by the oscillating body which sets up the sound waves. The speed of the waves is determined by the elastic/inertial properties of medium and the wavelength is then given by [tex]\lambda[/tex]= v/f.
As a practical example, think about an orchestra. If v did vary with f, the sounds from the different instruments would reach your ears at different times. The result would not be very musical:smile:
 
tonyh said:
No. The frequency is set by the oscillating body which sets up the sound waves. The speed of the waves is determined by the elastic/inertial properties of medium and the wavelength is then given by [tex]\lambda[/tex]= v/f.
As a practical example, think about an orchestra. If v did vary with f, the sounds from the different instruments would reach your ears at different times. The result would not be very musical:smile:

I always thought like that, but this is what I copied from wiki:
"The medium in which a sound wave is traveling does not always respond adiabatically, and as a result the speed of sound can vary with frequency".
 
pixel01 said:
I always thought like that, but this is what I copied from wiki:
"The medium in which a sound wave is traveling does not always respond adiabatically, and as a result the speed of sound can vary with frequency".
Possibly? An adiabatic process is one that occurs so rapidly, or in a system so well insulated, such that we can consider the heat transfer (Q) to be zero. But I do not know enough about the subject to be able to judge the wiki quote. My answer applies to a simple models though- at the very least, it's a good rule of thumb.
 
air at room temperature is so close to an ideal gas that the compressions and rarefractions of sound through reasonably dry air would be nearly completely adiabatic. if it is completely adiabatic, then

[tex]P v^\gamma = \mathrm{constant}[/tex]

and for diatomic gasses (air is 21% O2 and 78% N2) then [itex]\gamma = 5/2[/itex]. the speed of sound is dependent on that [itex]\gamma[/itex] and the measured speed of sound in air comes out very close to what the theory predicts. if the process weren't adiabatic, then there would not be the close agreement between the theory and experimental result.
 

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