Temperature inside an enclosed space

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the temperature dynamics within an enclosed space during summer, particularly focusing on why such spaces can become significantly hotter than the ambient outdoor temperature. Participants explore concepts related to heat retention, material properties, and shading techniques for outdoor air conditioning units.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Experimental/applied

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the ceiling space can become much hotter than the outdoor temperature, questioning the mechanisms behind this phenomenon, including the role of different wavelengths of radiation.
  • Another participant argues that the enclosed space functions similarly to a greenhouse, where materials like concrete or slate tiles absorb heat and reradiate infrared radiation, leading to increased temperatures, especially with ceiling insulation present.
  • A different viewpoint suggests that while shaded areas are cooler than direct sunlight, the air exchange between shaded and unshaded areas complicates the temperature dynamics, and questions are raised about the expected temperature savings from shading an air conditioner.
  • A participant poses a hypothetical question about the effects of placing aluminum foil on both a thermal conductor and a thermal insulator under sunlight, inquiring whether the air temperature beneath them would differ after exposure.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the greenhouse effect in enclosed spaces and the implications of shading on temperature dynamics. There is no consensus on the mechanisms at play or the outcomes of the proposed shading techniques.

Contextual Notes

Participants discuss assumptions about material properties and heat transfer without resolving the complexities of thermal dynamics in different contexts. The discussion includes hypothetical scenarios that remain untested.

Who May Find This Useful

Individuals interested in thermodynamics, environmental science, or practical applications of shading and insulation techniques may find this discussion relevant.

black hole 123
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its summer where i live and the ceiling space gets extremely hot, much hotter than ambient outdoor.

under a shade outdoor, the air temp beneath shade will be colder than air temp in sunlight. yet in a space with no air flow, the temp is always hotter from my experience. why is this? this isn't a greenhouse like inside a car where infrared comes through and becomes trapped. does microwave or longer wavelength pierce the ceiling and get trapped?

i want to shade my air con outdoor unit, what material is best used for this? want to reflect as much sunlight as possible
 
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black hole 123 said:
this isn't a greenhouse like inside a car where infrared comes through and becomes trapped

Yes it is a form of greenhouse. Regardless of the roof type, concrete / slate tiles, corrugated iron, etc Those materials get hot and
reradiate IR (heat) into the roof-space and because that heat can't escape ( even worse if there is ceiling insulation ... batts, insulfluff
etc it will heat up even more
 
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black hole 123 said:
under a shade outdoor, the air temp beneath shade will be colder than air temp in sunlight
Not necessarily..
The shade blocks the sunlight from you, or anything within the shade. Thus there is less of direct heating from solar to a surface.
Air moves around, so an exchange of air from outside the shade with the air within the shade will occur.
It is true though that the air temperature closer to a surface in a shade will be cooler than the air closer to a surface in direct sunlight.

Have you calculated the amount of "saving" you would expect if you shade your air conditioner?
 
ok, i didn't know about the reradiate in IR wavelength.

i have another question. if i put the same aluminium foil on a thermal conductor and a thermal insulator, and place both under the sun, suspended above ground with aluminium facing upwards, after many hours will the air beneath the thermal conductor be hotter or the same as for the thermal insulator? sorry if this sounds really dumb...
 

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