Tensor Conventions: V^*⊗V^*⊗V (1,2) vs (2,1)

In summary, physicists refer to a tensor of ## V^* \otimes V^* \otimes V## as (1,2) or (2,1). They do not classify the tensor itself as covariant or contravariant, but rather the components, where the contravariant index is labelled as ##a## and the covariant index is labelled as ##bc##. This distinction can cause confusion as mathematicians view these terms as properties of functors while physicists refer to coordinates on the same object.
  • #1
fresh_42
Mentor
Insights Author
2023 Award
18,994
23,992
How do physicists call a tensor of ## V^* \otimes V^* \otimes V##, (1,2) or (2,1)?
And which part do they call contravariant and which covariant?

I'm just not sure, whether the mathematical definition of funktors apply to the usances in physics.
(LUP - tensor)
 
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #2
I would say (1,2) - one in V and two in its dual. I would not call the tensor itself covariant or contravariant. I would say that the components transform co- or contravariantly. In this case, the components would be of the form ##T^a_{bc}## with the ##a## being labelled as a contravariant index whereas ##bc## would be labelled covariant.
 
  • #3
Thanks, that was my understanding, too. And, yes, that was my problem: the distinction between "transforms as" which refers to the behavior in a change of coordinates and the property itself, because mathematically the dual ##bc## part changes direction of morphisms and thus should have been contra instead of co. So the point is, that mathematicians use these terms as a property of functors whereas physicists refer to coordinates w.r.t. the same object.

I hope I finally got it now.
 
H2: What is the difference between "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (1,2)" and "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (2,1)"?

The notation "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (1,2)" means that the tensor product is taken in the order of V^*, V^*, and V, while "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (2,1)" means that the tensor product is taken in the order of V, V^*, and V^*. This notation is used to specify the order in which the tensor product is performed, which can affect the resulting tensor.

H2: How do I know which notation to use for "V^*⊗V^*⊗V"?

The notation used for "V^*⊗V^*⊗V" depends on the specific context and problem being studied. In general, the order of the tensor product should be chosen based on the desired properties or symmetries of the resulting tensor.

H2: Can the order of the tensor product affect the resulting tensor?

Yes, the order of the tensor product can affect the resulting tensor. This is because the tensor product is not commutative, meaning that changing the order of the factors can result in a different tensor. Therefore, it is important to carefully consider the order in which the tensor product is performed.

H2: What is the significance of the numbers in the notation "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (1,2)" and "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (2,1)"?

The numbers in the notation "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (1,2)" and "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (2,1)" represent the positions of the factors in the tensor product. For example, in "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (1,2)", the first two factors are V^* and the third factor is V, while in "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (2,1)", the first factor is V and the last two factors are V^*. These numbers help specify the order in which the tensor product is performed.

H2: How can I remember the difference between "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (1,2)" and "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (2,1)"?

One way to remember the difference is to think of the numbers in the notation as representing the positions of the factors in a matrix. For example, in "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (1,2)", the first two factors are represented in the first row of the matrix and the third factor is represented in the second row. In "V^*⊗V^*⊗V (2,1)", the first factor is represented in the second row and the last two factors are represented in the first row. This can help visualize the order in which the tensor product is performed.

Similar threads

  • Other Physics Topics
Replies
4
Views
1K
Replies
20
Views
2K
  • Other Physics Topics
Replies
8
Views
8K
  • Advanced Physics Homework Help
Replies
5
Views
2K
Replies
16
Views
3K
  • Linear and Abstract Algebra
Replies
32
Views
3K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
10
Views
702
  • Linear and Abstract Algebra
Replies
2
Views
914
  • Other Physics Topics
Replies
2
Views
1K
Back
Top