The Learning Channel: From Education to Exploitation

[Evo]

I remember when The Learning Channel started and was about knowledge, that was a LONG time ago. There has not been an educational program on there in more years than I can remember.

Now they are hosting the Miss America pageant. Their programming is nothing but garbage, programs like The Duggars (it's a vagina, not a clown car), and Jon and Kate + hate. Toddlers and Tiaras, about promoting the exploitation of very young girls in beauty pageants.

It is so sad that educational tv cannot survive in America. But do they have to degrade to such irresponsible trash?

 

[Proton Soup]

i wouldn't call the Duggars irresponsible, they're just... "different".

i think they also did the conjoined twin girls? that was interesting, and didn't seem to be too exploitative, but in general, i have a strong contempt for most things called "reality television".

and your thread made me think of this: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0234588/

 

[Evo]

i wouldn't call the Duggars irresponsible, they're just... "different".

In a world bordering on 7 billion and heading for disaster if the world population does not decrease soon, popping out children to satisfy some personal desire to continuously reproduce is irresponsible, IMO. I wonder if it is some kind of mental disorder that drives them to this?

 

[Proton Soup]

In a world bordering on 7 billion and heading for disaster if the world population does not decrease soon, popping out children to satisfy some personal desire to continuously reproduce is irresponsible, IMO. I wonder if it is some kind of mental disorder that drives them to this?

i can just about assure you that it is religious imperative.

 

[Loren Booda]

In a world bordering on 7 billion and heading for disaster if the world population does not decrease soon, popping out children to satisfy some personal desire to continuously reproduce is irresponsible, IMO. I wonder if it is some kind of mental disorder that drives them to this?

Blame not mental disorders, but greed and ignorance instead.

I naturally selected The Learning Channel out of my view years ago. What can we expect of quality with over 200 channels competing for an audience addicted to cheap thrills and no intellectual challenge? I often listen to the radio (which has landmines of its own) instead, preferably classical music or NPR.

 

[Evo]

Blame not mental disorders, but greed and ignorance instead.

I'm sure that's part of it, if she didn't keep popping out babies, she'd have no show, and no income. How can irresponsible breeding get you a tv show and huge amounts of money? What does this say about our society?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

i can just about assure you that it is religious imperative.

The Bible says to be fruitful and multiply, so I got fruit trees and a physics degree.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Evo, I think all of the science programming went to Discovery Science, and TLC is dedicated now to subjects like cooking.

The description below a google hit is: TLC online let's you explore family & parenting, home projects, cooking & recipes, weddings, fashion & more.

 

[zomgwtf]

Evo, I think all of the science programming went to Discovery Science, and TLC is dedicated now to subjects like cooking.

The description below a google hit is: TLC online let's you explore family & parenting, home projects, cooking & recipes, weddings, fashion & more.

While I do agree with this I have to say that Evo makes a good point. TLC back in the day was more about LEARNING those things, now it's mostly reality TV shows and the like. What can you learn from watching how a family with 18 children live? or how people who are 4 ft tall live? Not a whole lot. Sure it opens up what you do know about these people etc. but I can personally say I have never taken something from the show to apply to my personal life. (which is what used to be aired).

Discovery channel has gone down the SAME route. Now it's all about crab fishing in dangerous waters or which job in the world is the dirtiest. I remember as a child I used to sit and watch Discovery channel and I learned an EXTREMELY large amount about the solar system... space in general... our planet, animals, etc. etc. All this knowledge was poured into my head by watching discovery channel for a few hours straight at night time while I was sleeping over at my grandparents house (they had this black box that got all the channels for free. discovery channel was a 'pay more' option and my family didn't have the luxury of paying the more.)

Do you think a child could sit and watch discovery channel for a few hours at night time and actually 'learn' anything about science and technology that could be considered 'worth' knowing in a scientific community? I doubt it.

 

[Loren Booda]

I'm sure that's part of it, if she didn't keep popping out babies, she'd have no show, and no income. How can irresponsible breeding get you a tv show and huge amounts of money? What does this say about our society?

It's a burlesque on sex - apparently bread, circus and obscenity. To think that TV would use babies as perverse objects!

Give me the universe anytime.

 

[Evo]

Evo, I think all of the science programming went to Discovery Science, and TLC is dedicated now to subjects like cooking.

The description below a google hit is: TLC online let's you explore family & parenting, home projects, cooking & recipes, weddings, fashion & more.

What they air is mostly sensationalist garbage.

10 Years Younger
Complete strangers guess our participant's age. Then our glam squad goes to work and takes a decade off the person's look in just 10 days!

Toddlers & Tiaras
Toddlers and Tiaras follows families on their quest for sparkly crowns, big titles, and lots of cash.

Flowers Uncut
Follow "The Rock n' Roll Florist" Jeff Leatham as he creates jaw-dropping event spaces for million dollar clients.

Four Weddings
Four weddings, one dream honeymoon. Who will win?

You can look at the lineup here
http://tlc.discovery.com/tv/tv-shows.html

 

[Proton Soup]

I'm sure that's part of it, if she didn't keep popping out babies, she'd have no show, and no income. How can irresponsible breeding get you a tv show and huge amounts of money? What does this say about our society?

i'm not aware of this criticism of the Duggars. are you not thinking of Suleman (aka "Octomom")?

 

[Evo]

While I do agree with this I have to say that Evo makes a good point. TLC back in the day was more about LEARNING those things, now it's mostly reality TV shows and the like. What can you learn from watching how a family with 18 children live? or how people who are 4 ft tall live? Not a whole lot. Sure it opens up what you do know about these people etc. but I can personally say I have never taken something from the show to apply to my personal life. (which is what used to be aired).

Discovery channel has gone down the SAME route. Now it's all about crab fishing in dangerous waters or which job in the world is the dirtiest. I remember as a child I used to sit and watch Discovery channel and I learned an EXTREMELY large amount about the solar system... space in general... our planet, animals, etc. etc. All this knowledge was poured into my head by watching discovery channel for a few hours straight at night time while I was sleeping over at my grandparents house (they had this black box that got all the channels for free. discovery channel was a 'pay more' option and my family didn't have the luxury of paying the more.)

Do you think a child could sit and watch discovery channel for a few hours at night time and actually 'learn' anything about science and technology that could be considered 'worth' knowing in a scientific community? I doubt it.

It's really sad, there is very little on tv for children to watch and get excited about the wonders of the world around them. All kids see as being important is living excessively and being self absorbed, even psycho.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Obama made the comment that his girls are only allowed to watch Nik, and Disney.

 

[Evo]

i'm not aware of this criticism of the Duggars. are you not thinking of Suleman (aka "Octomom")?

The Duggars get tons of criticism.

http://www.google.com/search?source...&rlz=1T4GGLL_enUS339US339&q=duggars+clown+car

 

[Nebula815]

Court TV went the same route. They used to have fairly intellectual stuff, but then they converted into "Tru TV" and started airing much "hipper" stuff like police car chases and reality stuff and so forth, well their ratings have since shot up, but IMO the quality of the programming TANKED. I haven't watched TLC in ages, but sorry to read it has gone down the tank too, I still have a series about the universe on VHS that was recorded like back in 1994 that was awesome from TLC then.

In a world bordering on 7 billion and heading for disaster if the world population does not decrease soon, popping out children to satisfy some personal desire to continuously reproduce is irresponsible, IMO. I wonder if it is some kind of mental disorder that drives them to this?

Just wondering, but why do you say the world is heading for disaster with the population increasing? I think the population will probably start decreasing at some point.

Also, and this strays off-topic a bit (might need another thread even), but isn't the desire for people to have any children ultimately selfish? Because I doubt most people reason, "Hmm...the nation needs productive citizens to produce and pay taxes, so I'll do my patriotic duty and pop out some kids," it more seems just people say, "I want kids" or "We want children," which technically is probably selfish ultimately (because there is no way to know if the kid one is having would technically have wanted to be born into this world).

 

[leroyjenkens]

A testimate to how bad it has become; I had actually forgotten that TLC stands for The Learning Channel. I didn't realize you were talking about TLC until someone else mentioned it.
Did a little wikipedia reading and it has this to say...

Perhaps due to poor ratings from a narrow target audience, TLC began to explore new avenues starting in the mid '90s and increasingly towards and after the advent of the 21st century. Less and less material that most could be deemed to be truly educational in nature was featured on the channel. This was probably due to better ratings being achieved by shows such as these, as TLC brought in more viewers who were less interested in the other content being featured on the channel.

And...

In 1998 the channel officially began to distance itself from its original name "The Learning Channel", and instead began to advertise itself only as "TLC".

So it may not even be "The Learning Channel" anymore.

 

[MotoH]

I am only 16, but I remember back when I was a younger child when there was Discovery Wings, which basically had all you needed to know about aircraft design and how they work, plus a couple shows on people building planes and the like. That was an amazing channel. It then turned into the Military Channel, which also was extremely great in its first year of air. They had a whole bunch of shows on historic battles plus a bunch of weapon shows that were highly informative and entertaining. The Science channel used to be like this also (they still have some informational shows, but not as much as before.)

Who remembers the old History Channel? Oh that was awesome, all history all day basically, now they have a whole bunch of conspiracy shows on whether big foot exists or not. They still have some gems like Shootout and Modern Marvels, but the rest is not good at all.

I believe the main reason is because people want to watch the TV to be entertained, and today's society wants to watch 2 midgets that live on a farm working instead of learning about something of educational value.

Ahhh the joys of American television!

 

[Nebula815]

Who remembers the old History Channel? Oh that was awesome, all history all day basically, now they have a whole bunch of conspiracy shows on whether big foot exists or not. They still have some gems like Shootout and Modern Marvels, but the rest is not good at all.

I know! ANOTHER one that went down the crapper!

I believe the main reason is because people want to watch the TV to be entertained, and today's society wants to watch 2 midgets that live on a farm working instead of learning about something of educational value.

Ahhh the joys of American television!

I can understand the joys of watching quality entertainment, ranging from shows on USA like "Burn Notice," "Psych," "White Collar," "Royal Pains," etc...which are light-hearted fun, to the programming on other channels like "Law and Order" to other premium TV shows even that are quality drama with good writing and good storytelling and plots, but I do not get this obsession with these crazy reality TV shows!

 

[Evo]

Just wondering, but why do you say the world is heading for disaster with the population increasing? I think the population will probably start decreasing at some point.

The Royal Society and the National Academy of Sciences
on Population Growth and Sustainability

World population is growing at the unprecedented rate of almost 100 million people every year, and human activities are producing major changes in the global environment. If current predictions of population growth prove accurate and patterns of human activity on the planet remain unchanged, science and technology may not be able to prevent either irreversible degradation of the environment or continued poverty for much of the world.

The following joint statement, prepared by the Officers of the Royal Society of London and the United States National Academy of Sciences, reflects the judgement of a group of scientists knowledgeable about the historic contributions of science and technology to economic growth and environmental protection. It also reflects the shared view that sustainable development implies a future in which life is improved worldwide through economic development, where local environments and the biosphere are protected, and science is mobilized to create new opportunities for human progress.

Through this statement, the two academies wish to draw attention to these issues and to stimulate debate among scientists. decision makers. and the public. In addition. the two institutions, in cooperation with other academies, propose to organize a scientific conference in early 1993 to explore these issues in detail.

SIR MICHAEL ATIYAH
President The Royal Society of London

DR. FRANK PRESS
President The U.S. National Academy of Sciences

http://dieoff.org/page7.htm

The United Nations also came out with strong warnings of the disaster that was caused by overpopulation and was so fiercely attacked by the Catholic church that the UN dropped the whole thing.

I don't want to drag this thread off topic with this.

 

[Proton Soup]

The Duggars get tons of criticism.

http://www.google.com/search?source...&rlz=1T4GGLL_enUS339US339&q=duggars+clown+car

yes, I'm aware of the clown car motivator. i mean your specific criticism that they could not afford to raise their kids without the publicity from the show.

 

[MotoH]

The United Nations also came out with strong warnings of the disaster that was caused by overpopulation and was so fiercely attacked by the Catholic church that the UN dropped the whole thing.

I don't want to drag this thread off topic with this.

We sure do pick some odd things to defend against. To be fair we believe in evolution


Like the article you quoted says, mother nature no longer has her population cleanser (pandemics) to keep the population in check because of modern medicine. I don't advocate the killing of millions, but the baby making needs to go down drastically.
Besides, it is just selfish to have that many kids(8), because they most likely aren't going to get the love and care that 1 or 2 children get.

 

[Evo]

yes, I'm aware of the clown car motivator. i mean your specific criticism that they could not afford to raise their kids without the publicity from the show.

I never made any specific claim, but, the wife doesn't work and the husband doesn't make enough to afford their current lifestyle. They spend $2,000 a month just on food. It was on tv, so I don't have anything to link to. I'm sure there is something about it online, most of what they live off of and their home is provided as a result of the show.

 

[Proton Soup]

The wife doesn't work and the husband doesn't make enough to afford their current lifestyle. They spend $2,000 a month just on food. It was on tv, so I don't have anything to link to. I'm sure there is something about it online, most of what they live off of and their home is provided as a result of the show.

OK. but i believe they had most of these kids before the show began. perhaps they were in dire straits, i don't know. or perhaps the show has simply raised their current lifestyle.

 

[Evo]

OK. but i believe they had most of these kids before the show began. perhaps they were in dire straits, i don't know. or perhaps the show has simply raised their current lifestyle.

I never said that they couldn't afford them. This is all I said. I don't know where you got the idea that I specifically made any claim about them affording anything.

I'm sure that's part of it, if she didn't keep popping out babies, she'd have no show, and no income. How can irresponsible breeding get you a tv show and huge amounts of money? What does this say about our society?

 

[Phrak]

Ahem.

The physics forum channel began as a physics-centric thing. We get distracted by other issues and post to threads in the PF lounge 'n stuff because they yank on our emotional strings. And here we are--distracted.

How many initiated posts are inquisitive physics vs. the "I haf-to-do-physics-homework" channel or tintilating distractions such as the channel in which we are now participating, here and now?

The same devolution happens here as happens on the television, and I am a willing participant.

Why? And, am I making sense to anyone?

 

[Proton Soup]

I never said that they couldn't afford them. This is all I said. I don't know where you got the idea that I specifically made any claim about them affording anything.

i guess it was the "no income" part. maybe it's a little old-fashioned, but there still are a lot of families out there with stay-at-home moms.

 

[robertm]

I think the best recent show on t.v. has got to be 'How its Made' on the science channel; its just straight up simple information about cool obscure industrial processes, awesome.

I have to say though, the sci. channel is slowly beginning to show more and more crap like all the rest of them, but they still do Cosmos marathons from time to time.

 

[zomgwtf]

The Duggars make a lot of their income from properties they own and rent out to various companies/people. I'm not certain if they' be able to maintain their lifestyle without having a TV show however. I don't even know how much the family would earn from having a TV show. All I do know is their house inside is VERY nice (the outside I think is a bit toooo old fashion for my taste.)

And I second the comments about the history channel, however at night time... like at 2am they have some pretty interesting shows on that are ACTUALLY about history. They also have some really good movies on with this old lady who explains stuff to you briefly before commercials.

 

[rootX]

Mine learning channel:
http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/web/courses/courses/index.htm

But I prefer to pay to learn things which is more efficient way.

 

[JDStupi]

Phrak, I see what you're saying, but at the same time you have to look at it as a matter of ratios. True, people do want emotional string-yanking and mindless entertainment sometimes, everybody is guilty of it, but their are PLENTY of channels for that, and I believe the people here are complaining that even the few channels/programs set aside for education have devolved into mindless entertainment.

 

[Nebula815]

Traditional orchestras are struggling now too, because people just are not into hearing symphonies and classical music anymore.

 

[GeorginaS]

I'm sure that's part of it, if she didn't keep popping out babies, she'd have no show, and no income. How can irresponsible breeding get you a tv show and huge amounts of money? What does this say about our society?

The show's only been on for three years, going on its fourth season coming up, and they're on their 19th child. Reality teevee featuring watching people in their homes didn't exist when these two decided to "let God decide how many children they'd have".

I know it's not the source of choice around here, but http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/18_Kids_and_Counting"

I agree with the "not a clown car" idea, though.

And yes, I remember with TLC launched, and I had high hopes for it. I had high hopes for all sorts of possibilities with the extra cable channels. It really hasn't improved the situation a whole lot, has it? Although we do have The Food Network -- that makes me happy -- and The Comedy Channel. It's not all bad, but it's unfortunate that we can't seem to develop or there's no interest in high-quality educational stuff.

 

[story645]

I think the best recent show on t.v. has got to be 'How its Made' on the science channel; its just straight up simple information about cool obscure industrial processes, awesome.

How Do They Do It? is very similar, 'cept with a British narrator. Unfortunately, both are on at the oddest hours. I miss "Junkyard Wars", which I just learned had been on TLC at some point.

The whole dozen kids doesn't faze me 'cause I know enough religious Jews with very large families. I've babysat kids from families with tons of kids, and helped out in homes where there are lots of kids, and learned they they're really just like everybody else in most ways. And very frugal, hand me downs and second hand stuff all the way. Volunteer and paid help also go a long way, as does the fact that in most large families the older kids help out a ton.

I like the TLC girly shows about makeovers and bridal gowns, even liked John and Kate before it became a disaster, but I sympathize at the lack of intelligent shows on the channel.

 

[206PiruBlood]

I grew up watching the history channel and loved it! A constant flurry of information which followed me all the way through university. Now I watch the history channel and am so disappointed! It seems like everything on television today is about hypothetical world endings or conspiracy theories except for a select few programs. This seems to be the general trend on every network though, not just the history channel.

Its nice that the history and the discovery channel get people excited about science; however, they teach virtually nothing. Unfortunately education is not a competitive form of "entertainment" anymore :(

 

[zomgwtf]

I think that The Food Network is a great channel, I learn plenty from it. I actually think that it's the only channel I watch during the day time. At night other good show are on history and discovery (this is at like 2am) so I watch those instead unless a movie is on.

I love Iron Chef... it's just so fun

 

[AverageJoe]

Let's discover...howe & howe tech!...ugh...
Just as bad as the loggers on History.

 

[Moonbear]

Well, I agree that the Duggar's are not much in the way of quality programming. And, it's true, they couldn't afford all those kids before they had a reality TV show...the very first episodes were basically them getting help building a house they were trying to build themselves and not able to finish until the TV producers came along and hired crews to finish it for them.

However, I have seen good programming on TLC still. I like shows like Mystery Diagnosis and Diagnosis X. They're pretty educational, and accurate. They aren't on as often, because they also air on Discovery Health, but for me, that's in the digital programming line-up and I only get that one the one TV with the converter box (and won't get it at all if I give up the converter box if rates go up much at the end of my first year of subscribing).

I pretty much watch 3 channels that are all in a row here...Comedy Central, TLC, and Discovery Channel. When shows like the Duggar's or the one about all the morbidly obese people getting gastric bypass (really, why is that interesting after one episode? It's all the same thing) are on TLC or Discovery, that's when I watch Comedy Central.

 

[Phyisab****]

Is it possible that a government sponsored math and science, channel could actually have a positive economic effect on a country, rather than just wasting money? I think it's possible.

 

[Pinu7]

In a world bordering on 7 billion and heading for disaster if the world population does not decrease soon, popping out children to satisfy some personal desire to continuously reproduce is irresponsible, IMO. I wonder if it is some kind of mental disorder that drives them to this?

Survival of humanity should be the LAST thing a couple should think about.

 

[noblegas]

It is so sad that educational tv cannot survive in America. But do they have to degrade to such irresponsible trash?

Where else in the world is it really embraced? Frankly , I am thankful that we have podcasts that contain a variety of subjects and selections that you are curious about or interested in that does not rely on ratings in order for the particular podcast you are interested in to continue . good riddance to TLC and the discovery, and frankly television as a whole because it has collective gone done in production and programming quality.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

As for quality programming, you can't beat PBS.

I take issue with a number of their lecture series, but other than that, I find that PBS programming is usually the best [hightest quality] to be found. Most Novas are anywhere between good and excellent. Nature is good. Frontline is an excellent political documentary series. Sesame street has been running how long now? Heck, I have even learned to enjoy the Antique Road Show, which comes on after my thirty-year standard and the most reliable and in-depth [substantive] news service on television - The News Hour and the affiliated news programming. You won't find anyone on The News Hour or any other program yelling at or crying for the camera. Guests are required to allow others to speak their turn; then to respond in a reasonable manner. In fact, guests of any bias are even allowed to make their points without being cut off by the interviewer and forced to respond to nonsense.

Interesting that the opponents of public television have long argued it is unnecessary because commerical markets will fill the void. Apparently they don't.

 

[zomgwtf]

I love PBS and the Antiques Roadshow is one of my favorite shows . Sometimes they have really interesting things on there.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I love PBS and the Antiques Roadshow is one of my favorite shows . Sometimes they have really interesting things on there.

The History Detectives can also be quite interesting and educational.

 

[robertm]

Is it possible that a government sponsored math and science, channel could actually have a positive economic effect on a country, rather than just wasting money? I think it's possible.

Oh man, wouldn't that be awesome?

My area has a local cable county government channel and a county department of education channel. The Gov. channel just plays reruns of anti-crime programs from the 90's and safety/stream maintenance programs (which are, though outdated, useful). The Edu. Channel mostly just shows slide shows of little kids art put to classical music (which is really nice to have in the background), but occasionally they do play some discussions of art, poetry, economics, child development etc. Nothing of really high quality and all made in the 90's.

Either of these channels could easily be used to show math and science lectures. Being in Georgia, perhaps they could even tape some lecture series from UGA or GTech for little to no cost on their part.

 

[story645]

The onion's got a fun article on this: http://www.theonion.com/content/news/science_channel_refuses_to_dumb

 

[Pythagorean]

Evo, I agree completely about TLC and the whole other batch of supposed "learning" channels out there nowadays. But that's ok, because we have the internet and TED and GoogleTalks and a number of open courses online (such as Yale). We no longer need to be spoon fed our educational visual/audio stimulation. We can hand pick it!

 

[Phyisab****]

Officials also noted that the cable channel greatly values the 18- to 45-year-old demographic of louts, clods, and empty-headed dumb ****s.

"I don't like it when the science people talk about things no one can even understand," said Rich Parker, an Ohio resident. "It's like, just quit your yapping and dip the chain saw into the liquid nitrogen already." That makes me feel better thanks for the link.

 

[Pythagorean]

"It's like, just quit your yapping and dip the chain saw into the liquid nitrogen already."

what does that even mean?

 

[story645]

what does that even mean?

I think it's the tendency to drop out anything educational in favor of the things that would be really bad ideas if not done in a supervised setting. It's best seen in mythbusters, where an obscure myth would probably be dug up just to justify "dipping a chain saw into liquid nitrogen."