The true definition of Poynting effect for simple shear

  • Thread starter Thread starter feynman1
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Definition Shear
AI Thread Summary
The discussion centers on the definition of the Poynting effect in the context of simple shear deformation, specifically regarding normal and shear stress components. Participants explore whether non-zero normal stresses in the presence of shear can be classified as the Poynting effect. The conversation highlights that the stress tensor's behavior is non-linear during large deformations, leading to complex interactions between shear and normal stresses. There is a debate about the importance of precise terminology versus the existence of the effect itself, with an acknowledgment that clarity is essential for comparing findings in the literature. Ultimately, the focus remains on understanding the implications of shear on stress states rather than strictly defining the Poynting effect.
feynman1
Messages
435
Reaction score
29
Consider a simple shear x=kY, y=Y, z=Z. How is Poynting effect defined? If the normal stress along y is 0 but that along x isn't 0, is that also a sort of Poynting effect?
 
Engineering news on Phys.org
You're talking about the effect of pressure on the Gibbs free energy?
 
Chestermiller said:
You're talking about the effect of pressure on the Gibbs free energy?
No, but about shear and the corresponding normal stresses
 
feynman1 said:
No, but about shear and the corresponding normal stresses
I have no idea what you are referring to. Are you asking about the components of the stress tensor for the shear deformation you defined?
 
Chestermiller said:
I have no idea what you are referring to. Are you asking about the components of the stress tensor for the shear deformation you defined?
Yes, the normal and shear stress components, that is discussion about the normal components when shear is present.
 
feynman1 said:
Yes, the normal and shear stress components, that is discussion about the normal components when shear is present.
OK. Are you familiar with the 3D tensorial version of Hooke's Law? If so, for this particular deformation, what does that predict for the components of the strain and stress tensors?
 
Chestermiller said:
OK. Are you familiar with the 3D tensorial version of Hooke's Law? If so, for this particular deformation, what does that predict for the components of the strain and stress tensors?
Yes and I did the analysis, just wonder the precise definition of the effect
 
feynman1 said:
Yes and I did the analysis, just wonder the precise definition of the effect
Precise definition of what effect?
 
Chestermiller said:
Precise definition of what effect?
poynting
 
  • #10
In large deformations (even shear), the stress tensor is not just a linear function of the strain tensor, however that is defined (there are many tensorially acceptable definitions for finite strains). It is a non-linear function of the strain tensor, and this non-linearity results in not only shear stresses, but also normal stresses that are functions of the amount of shear (in simple shear).
 
  • #11
Chestermiller said:
In large deformations (even shear), the stress tensor is not just a linear function of the strain tensor, however that is defined (there are many tensorially acceptable definitions for finite strains). It is a non-linear function of the strain tensor, and this non-linearity results in not only shear stresses, but also normal stresses that are functions of the amount of shear (in simple shear).
right, but that's just a description not a rigorous definition. Does poynting refer to nonzero normal stresses or one specific normal stress component?
 
  • #12
feynman1 said:
right, but that's just a description not a rigorous definition. Does poynting refer to nonzero normal stresses or one specific normal stress component?
For the deformation described in this thread, the state of stress is not isotropic, and all three normal stresses are non-zero.
 
  • #13
Chestermiller said:
For the deformation described in this thread, the state of stress is not isotropic, and all three normal stresses are non-zero.
So if only one of sigma_x and sigma_y is 0, will that be called poyning effect?
 
  • #14
feynman1 said:
So if only one of sigma_x and sigma_y is 0, will that be called poyning effect?
What it is specifically called does not matter (to me). What matters is whether such an effect exists.
 
  • Like
Likes feynman1
  • #15
Chestermiller said:
What it is specifically called does not matter (to me). What matters is whether such an effect exists.
agree, but that will affect assessment and comparison with the literature when not knowing if the same thing is discussed
 
Back
Top