Thermodynamics (final temperature, ice mixed with steam)

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a thermodynamics problem involving the mixing of ice and steam, specifically calculating the final temperature of the resulting mixture. The problem includes specific heats and latent heats relevant to phase changes between ice, water, and steam.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the calculations involving latent heat and specific heat, with one participant attempting to set up energy balance equations. There is also a suggestion to consider the problem in stages, focusing on phase changes and energy transfers.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided guidance on the setup of the equations, noting the importance of accounting for the initial temperatures of the water masses and the phase changes involved. There is an ongoing exploration of the definitions of steam versus water vapor, with no explicit consensus reached on the terminology.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the importance of including units in calculations and question the assumptions made about the states of water involved in the problem.

SigFig
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Homework Statement



If 10-kg of ice at 0 degrees Celsius is added to 2-kg of steam at 100 degrees Celsius, the temperature of the resulting mixture is? Use Joules. ANSWER: 40


Homework Equations



Specific Heats:
Ice = 2060
Steam = 2020

Latent Heats:
Water melting = 3.33x10^5
Water boiling = 2.26x10^6


The Attempt at a Solution


Q1=mL
Q1=10(3.34x10^5)
Q1=3.34x10^6

Q2=(2)(2.26x10^6)
Q2=4.52x10^6

Q2-Q1=1.18x10^6

Q=MCΔT
1.18x10^6 = (2+10)(4180)(T-0)
1.18x10^6 = 5.0x10^4T
T=23.6

Sadly 23.6 =/= 40
I've been trying to do this problem for over an hour now using every method I remember, stumped.
 
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I'm confused by the question. Steam is a suspension of water droplets in air, basically a cloud. Presumably you mean water vapour not steam?

In this system there will a phase change from ice to water that costs an amount of latent heat. There will also be a phase change from vapour to liquid, which releases an amount of latent heat.

Perhaps it is easier to think about in too stages. 1) The vapour releases its latent heat and becomes water. This heat is sufficient to provide the latent heat required to melt the ice to water at 0C, and then heat up the mass of water that was ice. So finally you're left with two blobs of water, 2kg at 100C and 10kg at some temperature above 0C.

The second stage (that you missed out): the temperature of the two water masses equilibrate.
 
SigFig said:

Homework Statement



If 10-kg of ice at 0 degrees Celsius is added to 2-kg of steam at 100 degrees Celsius, the temperature of the resulting mixture is? Use Joules. ANSWER: 40


Homework Equations



Specific Heats:
Ice = 2060
Steam = 2020

Latent Heats:
Water melting = 3.33x10^5
Water boiling = 2.26x10^6
Don't forget your units.

The Attempt at a Solution


Q1=mL
Q1=10(3.34x10^5)
Q1=3.34x10^6

Q2=(2)(2.26x10^6)
Q2=4.52x10^6

Q2-Q1=1.18x10^6
This is correct so far, :approve: except for the lack of units.
Q=MCΔT
1.18x10^6 = (2+10)(4180)(T-0)
Your approach *would* be correct, *if* the entire 12 kg of [liquid] water started from 0 deg C, and increased its temperature from there. But that's not the case for this problem.

Here, there is only 10 kg of [liquid] water, starting at 0o C, rising to temperature T, absorbing energy as it goes.

There is also 2 kg of [liquid] water, starting at 100o C, falling to temperature T (making a temperature change of 100 - T), releasing energy as it goes.

You'll need to re-set up your equation to account for both of these things. :wink:

JesseC said:
I'm confused by the question. Steam is a suspension of water droplets in air, basically a cloud. Presumably you mean water vapour not steam?
That's really a matter of semantics. But commonly, water in gaseous form is called steam. (In which case -- you are correct insofar that -- H2O is transparent when in truly gaseous form.)
 
Last edited:
It would also be nice if some units were included in the calculations.
 

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