Tolman-Oppenheimer-Volkoff equation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the Tolman-Oppenheimer-Volkoff (TOV) equation, focusing on its derivation and the discrepancies between various sources, including a reference paper and Wikipedia. Participants explore the mathematical formulations and identities related to the TOV equation, examining different approaches to derive it and the implications of the mass function in the equations.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes a mismatch between their derived TOV equation and the original derivation by Tolman, Oppenheimer, and Volkoff, as well as discrepancies with the Wikipedia entry.
  • Another participant suggests that if the equations are equivalent, the mass term in one reference must originate from the first 'u' term, leading to a series of algebraic manipulations to express 'u' in terms of other variables.
  • Multiple participants propose different forms for 'u', with varying expressions based on the mass function and pressure, indicating ongoing exploration of the correct formulation.
  • Some participants confirm identities and equations using Mathematica, but the symbolic proof remains unresolved for certain identities.
  • There is a claim that the Wikipedia entry for the TOV equation is incorrect, prompting further scrutiny of the equations presented there.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the correctness of the TOV equation as presented in various references, with some asserting that the Wikipedia version is incorrect. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the exact formulations and identities related to 'u' and the TOV equation.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in their derivations, including unresolved symbolic proofs and dependencies on specific mathematical identities. The discussion reflects a complex interplay of assumptions and definitions that are not fully settled.

  • #61
Lets see. The SC metric is correct, as it is the presumptive metric for a spherically symmetric body about a mass "M", PRIOR to solution. The actual solution for the metric would be to replace the exponents with (1-2M/r) and (1-2M/r)^-1 respectively. (but that's in the limit of a point M)

Continuing, as you can see from the line element in the Kerr metric, there exists an off-diagonal component that mixes time and Phi.

Don't mix up the Einstein tensor and the metric. I assume you just made a typo. But from the metric you can get to the Einstein tensor by using that code I showed you.

The .m file is just a package you run (basically just a function), then look at the demo. It defines a metric "metric" (aka "g") and from it and the normal coordinate vector calculates the Ricci tensor & scalar (thru christoffel) automatically and spits out the Einstein tensor ("G").As for whether or not the code can handle the Kerr metric, I don't see why not. But it may not be entirely useful yet. Once you have the "G" you set up all of your equations using the GR field equation, equating it to T. You should then have a set of equations that are solvable, with the connection you listed (P vs density).

Actually, now that I'm looking at your line element. Wouldn't it make sense that your matrix form be:
<br /> g_{\mu\nu} = \left(<br /> \begin{array}{llll}<br /> e^{\nu (r)} &amp; 0 &amp; 0 &amp; \frac{r_s r \alpha sin^2 \theta}{\rho^2} \\<br /> 0 &amp; -e^{\lambda (r)} &amp; 0 &amp; 0 \\<br /> 0 &amp; 0 &amp; - \rho^2 &amp; 0 \\<br /> \frac{r_s r \alpha sin^2 \theta}{\rho^2} &amp; 0 &amp; 0 &amp; - \left(r^2 + \alpha^2 + \frac{r_s r \alpha^2}{\rho^2} \sin ^2 \theta \right) <br /> \end{array}<br /> \right)<br />

The of diagonals give that extra term. THIS ABOVE IS NOT CORRECT AT ALL. I am just showing you where to start, there needs to be off diagonals.

http://www.astro.ku.dk/~milvang/RelViz/000_node12.html

has a way. Take a look.
 
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  • #62
remember your line element must be made from

<br /> ds^2=g_{\mu\nu} dx^\mu dx^\nu<br />

where dx^\mu is like (dt,dr,r d\theta, r sin\theta d\phi) I believe.
 
  • #63
Kerr metric...


The Kerr metric:
c^{2} d\tau^{2} = \left( 1 - \frac{r_{s} r}{\rho^{2}} \right) c^{2} dt^{2} <br /> - \frac{\rho^{2}}{\Lambda^{2}} dr^{2} - \rho^{2} d\theta^{2} - \left( r^{2} + \alpha^{2} + \frac{r_{s} r \alpha^{2}}{\rho^{2}} \sin^{2} \theta \right) \sin^{2} \theta \ d\phi^{2} + \frac{2r_{s} r\alpha \sin^{2} \theta }{\rho^{2}} \, c \, dt \, d\phi
\alpha = \frac{J}{Mc} \; \; \; \; \; \; \rho^{2} = r^{2} + \alpha^{2} \cos^{2} \theta \; \; \; \; \; \; \Lambda^{2} = r^{2} - r_{s} r + \alpha^{2}


I reduced each matrix element into the most trigonometric form.

g_{00} = 1 - \frac{r_{s} r}{\rho^{2}} = 1 - \frac{r_{s} r}{r^{2} + \alpha^{2} \cos^{2} \theta}
\boxed{g_{00} = 1 - \frac{r_{s} r}{r^{2} + \alpha^{2} \cos^{2} \theta}}
g_{03} = g_{30} = \frac{r_s r \alpha sin^2 \theta}{\rho^2} = \frac{r_s r \alpha sin^2 \theta}{r^{2} + \alpha^{2} \cos^{2} \theta}
\boxed{g_{03} = g_{30} = \frac{r_s r \alpha sin^2 \theta}{r^{2} + \alpha^{2} \cos^{2} \theta}}
g_{11} = - \frac{\rho^{2}}{\Lambda^{2}} = - \frac{r^{2} + \alpha^{2} \cos^{2} \theta}{r^{2} - r_{s} r + \alpha^{2}}
\boxed{g_{11} = - \frac{r^{2} + \alpha^{2} \cos^{2} \theta}{r^{2} - r_{s} r + \alpha^{2}}}
g_{22} = - \rho^2 = - (r^{2} + \alpha^{2} \cos^{2} \theta)
\boxed{g_{22} = - (r^{2} + \alpha^{2} \cos^{2} \theta)}

g_{\mu \nu} = \left( \begin{array}{llll} 1-\frac{r r_s}{r^2+\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta )} &amp; 0 &amp; 0 &amp; \frac{r \alpha \sin ^2(\theta ) r_s}{r^2+\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta )} \\ 0 &amp; - \frac{r^2+\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta )}{r^2-r_s r+\alpha ^2} &amp; 0 &amp; 0 \\ 0 &amp; 0 &amp; -r^2-\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta ) &amp; 0 \\ \frac{r \alpha \sin ^2(\theta ) r_s}{r^2+\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta )} &amp; 0 &amp; 0 &amp; \sin ^2(\theta ) \left(-r^2-\alpha ^2 \sin ^2(\theta ) r_s r-\alpha ^2\right) \end{array} \right)

Einsteintensor source code:
In[n]=
Code:
ToFileName[{$TopDirectory, "AddOns", "Applications"}]
<< einsteintensor.m
x = {t, r, \[Theta], \[Phi]}
(metric = {{1 - (Subscript[r, s]*r)/(r^2 + \[Alpha]^2*Cos[\[Theta]]^2), 0, 0, (Subscript[r, s]*r*\[Alpha]*Sin[\[Theta]]^2)/(r^2 + \[Alpha]^2*Cos[\[Theta]]^2)}, {0, -((r^2 + \[Alpha]^2*Cos[\[Theta]]^2)/(r^2 - Subscript[r, s]*r + \[Alpha]^2)), 0, 0}, {0, 0, -(r^2 + \[Alpha]^2*Cos[\[Theta]]^2), 0}, {(Subscript[r, s]*r*\[Alpha]*Sin[\[Theta]]^2)/(r^2 + \[Alpha]^2*Cos[\[Theta]]^2), 0, 0, -(r^2 + \[Alpha]^2 + Subscript[r, s]*r*\[Alpha]^2*Sin[\[Theta]]^2)*Sin[\[Theta]]^2}}) // MatrixForm
(tensor = {{\[Rho][r]*c^2, 0, 0, Subscript[\[CapitalPhi], \[Epsilon]][r]}, {0, -P[r], 0, 0},{0, 0, -P[r], 0}, {Subscript[\[Rho], p][r], 0, 0, -P[r]}}) // MatrixForm
(Einstein = Inverse[metric].Simplify[EinsteinTensor[metric, x], TimeConstraint -> 3600]) // MatrixForm
MaxMemoryUsed[]

The resulting evaluation function required a lot of memory:
MaxMemoryUsed[] = 1745544760 bytes

Unfortunately, my computer does have enough memory to complete all the transformations and the result:[/Color]
Simplify::time: Time spent on a transformation exceeded 300 seconds, and the transformation was aborted.
General::stop: Further output of Simplify::time will be suppressed during this calculation.
[/Color]
Reference:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kerr_metric"
http://library.wolfram.com/infocenter/MathSource/162/"
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #64

Correction, the matrix and source code from previous post should be:
\boxed{g_{33} = \sin ^2(\theta ) \left(-r^2-\frac{\alpha ^2 \sin ^2(\theta ) r_s r}{r^2+\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta )}-\alpha ^2\right)}

[/Color]
g_{\mu \nu} = \left( \begin{array}{llll} 1 - \frac{r r_s}{r^2+\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta )} &amp; 0 &amp; 0 &amp; \frac{r \alpha \sin ^2(\theta ) r_s}{r^2+\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta )} \\ 0 &amp; -\frac{r^2+\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta )}{r^2-r_s r+\alpha ^2} &amp; 0 &amp; 0 \\ 0 &amp; 0 &amp; -r^2-\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta ) &amp; 0 \\ \frac{r \alpha \sin ^2(\theta ) r_s}{r^2+\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta )} &amp; 0 &amp; 0 &amp; \sin ^2(\theta ) \left(-r^2-\frac{\alpha ^2 \sin ^2(\theta ) r_s r}{r^2+\alpha ^2 \cos ^2(\theta )}-\alpha ^2\right) \end{array} \right)

Einsteintensor source code:
In[n]=
Code:
ToFileName[{$TopDirectory, "AddOns", "Applications"}]
<< einsteintensor.m
x = {t, r, \[Theta], \[Phi]}
(metric = {{1 - (Subscript[r, s]*r)/(r^2 + \[Alpha]^2*Cos[\[Theta]]^2), 0, 0, (Subscript[r, s]*r*\[Alpha]*Sin[\[Theta]]^2)/(r^2 + \[Alpha]^2*Cos[\[Theta]]^2)}, {0, -((r^2 + \[Alpha]^2*Cos[\[Theta]]^2)/(r^2 - Subscript[r, s]*r + \[Alpha]^2)), 0, 0}, {0, 0, -(r^2 + \[Alpha]^2*Cos[\[Theta]]^2), 0}, {(Subscript[r, s]*r*\[Alpha]*Sin[\[Theta]]^2)/(r^2 + \[Alpha]^2*Cos[\[Theta]]^2), 0, 0, -(r^2 + \[Alpha]^2 + (Subscript[r, s]*r*\[Alpha]^2*Sin[\[Theta]]^2)/(r^2 + \[Alpha]^2*Cos[\[Theta]]^2))*Sin[\[Theta]]^2}}) // MatrixForm
(tensor = {{\[Rho][r]*c^2, 0, 0, Subscript[\[CapitalPhi], \[Epsilon]][r]}, {0, -P[r], 0, 0},{0, 0, -P[r], 0}, {Subscript[\[Rho], p][r], 0, 0, -P[r]}}) // MatrixForm
(Einstein = Inverse[metric].Simplify[EinsteinTensor[metric, x], TimeConstraint -> 3600]) // MatrixForm
MaxMemoryUsed[]
[/Color]
 
Last edited:
  • #65
neutron star mass-radius relation...


The neutron star mass-radius relation is dependent on a particular neutron star model, however the mass-radius relation for my model based upon the Proton charge radius and Tolman mass equation solution VII:

m_n = 1.6749272928 \cdot 10^{-27} \; \text{kg} - Neutron mass
r_p = 0.8757 \cdot 10^{-15} \; \text{m} - Proton charge radius

Proton charge radius neutron density:
\rho_n = \frac{3 m_n}{4 \pi r_p^3}

Neutron star core density equivalent to Proton charge radius neutron density:
\rho_c = \rho_n

Total Tolman mass equation solution VII:
M_0(R) = \frac{8 \pi \rho_c R^3}{15} = \frac{8 \pi R^3}{15} \left( \frac{3 m_n}{4 \pi r_p^3} \right) = \frac{2 m_n R^3}{5 r_p^3}

Total mass-radius relation equation for Tolman solution VII:
\boxed{M_0(R) = \frac{2 m_n R^3}{5 r_p^3}}

Mass of a 10 km radius Tolman VII neutron star:
\boxed{M_0(10 \; \text{km}) = 9.976 \cdot 10^{29} \; \text{kg}}

\boxed{M_0(10 \; \text{km}) = 0.501 \cdot M_{\odot}}

Note that the lower limit for total radius R, is equivalent to the Schwarzschild radius and the upper limit for total mass M(R), is equivalent to the Tolman-Oppenheimer-Volkov mass limit.
[/Color]
Reference:
Neutron - Wikipedia
TOV #39 - Orion1
TOV #47 - Orion1
Schwarzschild radius - Wikipedia
Tolman-Oppenheimer-Volkoff mass limit - Wikipedia
 

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