Transient response of a system (control)

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around solving a control system problem involving the transient response, specifically finding the values of T and K that yield a percent overshoot of 0.254 and a peak time of 3. Participants are exploring the equations related to the system's behavior and expressing difficulties in arriving at a solution.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Participants express uncertainty about how to solve the two equations necessary for determining T and K.
  • One participant notes the need to divide both the numerator and denominator of the transfer function by T for proper calculations.
  • Another participant identifies a discrepancy in their calculations regarding damping and the natural frequency, indicating that their derived values do not align with expected results.
  • It is mentioned that the problem is overdetermined, as there are three equations for two unknowns, leading to confusion about the formulation of the problem.
  • A specific damping ratio value is proposed that leads to the desired natural frequency, but this value does not yield the expected percent overshoot.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that there are issues with the problem formulation and that the equations do not yield consistent results. However, no consensus is reached on the correct approach to resolve the discrepancies.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in the problem setup, including the overdetermined nature of the equations and the potential misalignment of derived values with expected outcomes.

silentwf
Messages
35
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement



Find T,K value such that the system's percent overshoot is .254 and peak time is 3
[PLAIN]http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/6139/problemz.png

Homework Equations


[PLAIN]http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/51/releq.png

The Attempt at a Solution


[PLAIN]http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/4818/solz.png
(I had problems using the LATEX built into this forum, so i used another tool to generate the equations. sorry about the loading times).

The main question i have up to now is i have no idea how to solve the two equations. Another thing i want to confirm is whether there is anything wrong with my equations. I've worked on this problem a few times, and i always get stuck on the two equations. any idea on how to solve this problem?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Physics news on Phys.org
silentwf said:

Homework Statement



Find T,K value such that the system's percent overshoot is .254 and peak time is 3
[PLAIN]http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/6139/problemz.png

Homework Equations


[PLAIN]http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/51/releq.png

The Attempt at a Solution


[PLAIN]http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/4818/solz.png
(I had problems using the LATEX built into this forum, so i used another tool to generate the equations. sorry about the loading times).

The main question i have up to now is i have no idea how to solve the two equations. Another thing i want to confirm is whether there is anything wrong with my equations. I've worked on this problem a few times, and i always get stuck on the two equations. any idea on how to solve this problem?

First of all, you must divide both the numerator and the denominator of your TF by T, in order to make the calculations.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Hey,
Okay, that was something I missed. After reworking it, there's still something wrong with it:
[PLAIN]http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/6645/solk.png
as you can see, although i have solved for the values for %OS and Tpeak in the 3rd and 4th line of the picture, the solutions do not match the last part of the second line, which is that damping = 1 / (2*w).

any idea?

forgot to add, the answer provides that T=1.09 and K=1.424, which gives w=1.143 and damping=0.437. but with this answer (damping), %OS becomes .217...so not sure where went wrong
 
Last edited by a moderator:
silentwf said:
Hey,
Okay, that was something I missed. After reworking it, there's still something wrong with it:
[PLAIN]http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/6645/solk.png
as you can see, although i have solved for the values for %OS and Tpeak in the 3rd and 4th line of the picture, the solutions do not match the last part of the second line, which is that damping = 1 / (2*w).

any idea?

forgot to add, the answer provides that T=1.09 and K=1.424, which gives w=1.143 and damping=0.437. but with this answer (damping), %OS becomes .217...so not sure where went wrong

You have three equations for two unknowns (\zeta and \omega_n). The system is overdetermined.
It is interesting that using \zeta = 0.3998 in the third equation, gives the wanted solution for \omega_n and substituting this value in the first equation gives the wanted solution for \zeta.
The problem is ill formulated.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I agree. Thanks for your help though, really saved me from wasting hours on this problem.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
4K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
4K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
Replies
15
Views
3K