Two types of electrical charge?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the nature of electrical charge, specifically questioning why only two types of electrical charge are recognized and exploring the implications of charge conservation in various reactions. The scope includes theoretical considerations and conceptual clarifications related to charge types and interactions.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that only two types of electrical charge exist, while others question the completeness of this view, suggesting the possibility of multiple charge types with limited interactions.
  • A participant humorously notes that the search for additional charge types was halted in 1947 due to budget constraints, raising questions about the validity of current charge classifications.
  • Another participant introduces the concept of quark charges, which include fractional charges, but notes their short-lived nature.
  • Concerns are raised about the conservation of total charge versus the conservation of individual types of charge, with examples provided from radioactive decay processes illustrating how positive and negative charges can change simultaneously.
  • It is discussed that while total charge is conserved, individual conservation of positive and negative charges is not observed in nature, as evidenced by particle interactions such as electron-positron pair creation and annihilation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the classification of electrical charge, with no consensus reached on the existence of additional charge types or the implications of charge conservation in reactions.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in understanding charge types and conservation, particularly regarding the definitions and interactions of charges in various physical processes.

kindlychung
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Why are we so sure that there are only two types of electrical charge?
 
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Because we have look far and wide, and only found two. (or three if you count neutral :) )
 
How far and how wide?
Is it possible to have multiple types of charge only two types of interaction between them?
 
kindlychung said:
How far and how wide?
Is it possible to have multiple types of charge only two types of interaction between them?

Actually we called off the search on October 3, 1947. Budget ran out and they instead decided to pass it over to the search for the 16th way that you can make an Upside-down Pineapple Cake.

If there were multiple types of charge and they only interacted in two ways, then what would differentiate the types of charges? Electrodynamics is a theory that explains the behavior of the electromagnetic force. If you add redundant elements to this theory, how would you change anything?
 
There are also quark charges, ±1e/3 and ±2e/3, but quarks are very short-lived.

Bob S
 
im having this doubt.. why is that 'total' charge is conserved...why don't we have all negative and all positive charge conserved...ie say total negative charges pre and post a reaction should be the same rt ?
 
ravisastry said:
im having this doubt.. why is that 'total' charge is conserved...why don't we have all negative and all positive charge conserved...ie say total negative charges pre and post a reaction should be the same rt ?
Separately conserving positive charge (protons) and negative charge (electrons) is not observed in nature. Consider for example, the radioactive isotope copper-64 (an odd-odd nucleus with 29 protons). Sometimes it decays by beta- (electron) decay to a zinc isotope (30 protons), sometimes by beta+ (positron) decay to a nickel isotope (28 protons), and sometimes by capturing an atomic electron (in the K-shell) to become a nickel isotope. So sometimes the number of positive charges increases, and sometimes decreases. The number of negative charges (electrons) changes accordingly. The only observed conserved quantities are baryon numbers (neutrons + protons), lepton numbers (charged leptons + neutrinos), and total charge. This is even true when antiparticles (like antiprotons) are involved.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper-64

Bob S
 
Last edited:
ravisastry said:
im having this doubt.. why is that 'total' charge is conserved...why don't we have all negative and all positive charge conserved...ie say total negative charges pre and post a reaction should be the same rt ?

An electron and positron can both vanish together. Or, a pair can be created. Clearly, both kinds of charges' counts change. But they always change together.
 

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