Understanding the Formula in my Book

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a formula involving symmetries and reflections in three-dimensional space, specifically focusing on the operations sigma^(1), C_2, and sigma^(12). Participants are trying to understand the implications of these operations as described in a textbook.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the order of operations in the formula and how it affects the outcome. There are suggestions to represent the symmetries as permutations or matrices to clarify the operations. Some participants question the transcription of the formula and its connection to the symmetry group D2h.

Discussion Status

There are multiple interpretations of the order of operations being discussed, and some participants have offered guidance on how to approach the problem through different representations. However, there is no explicit consensus on the correct interpretation or transcription of the formula.

Contextual Notes

Participants have noted the need for additional context from the textbook, including the specific excerpt and edition, to better understand the problem. There is also mention of varying conventions in the application of the operations.

M. Kohlhaas
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Hello,

in my Book is a formula, namely

sigma^(1) C_2 = sigma^(12)

where sigma^(1) is a reflection about the x-z-plane, C_2 is a pi-rotation about the z-axis and sigma^(12) is a reflection about the midway plane between x-z- and y-z-plane. When i in my Imagination make the steps on the left I come out at a totally different point as where the right-hand side would send me. Obviously I have completely misunderstood the formula and I don't the the sun anymore. Can someone please explain me the meaning of that statement?

Thanks a lot
 
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Consider a unit cube and label its corners 1 through 6. Then you can write down how the symmetries act on these corners as a permutation.
Also, note that there is no general consensus on the order of the operations, some people mean "first do [itex]\sigma^1[/itex] then [itex]C_2[/itex]" when they write down [itex]\sigma^1 C_2[/itex], some people read it as "perform [itex]\sigma^1[/itex] after [itex]C_2[/itex]". Maybe this is why you don't get the same answer?

Alternatively, you could write out the operations as matrices working on the vectors of a standard orthonormal basis and work out the left hand side by matrix multiplication.
 
Either it's wrong or there's some error in transcribing it. The LHS is equivalent to a reflection about the y-z plane.

Can you include the complete excerpt from the book - this will provide some context and make it possible to debug. Also include the name and edition of the book. The connection between the above operations and the symmetry group in the title (D2h) is also not clear.
 
CompuChip said:
Also, note that there is no general consensus on the order of the operations, some people mean "first do [itex]\sigma^1[/itex] then [itex]C_2[/itex]" when they write down [itex]\sigma^1 C_2[/itex], some people read it as "perform [itex]\sigma^1[/itex] after [itex]C_2[/itex]". Maybe this is why you don't get the same answer?
In this case the convention is to first apply [itex]C_2[/itex] and then [itex]\sigma^(1)[/itex].


Gokul43201 said:
Can you include the complete excerpt from the book - this will provide some context and make it possible to debug. Also include the name and edition of the book. The connection between the above operations and the symmetry group in the title (D2h) is also not clear.
The book's name is "symmetry - an introduction to group theory" written by Roy McWeeny. Hier is an excerpt; the certain special thing which i asked for is marked in red:

http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/9528/bahnhof2xt7.th.jpg
 
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