Units of slope in a tension vs θ (theta) graph

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding the units of slope in a semi-logarithmic graph where the y-axis represents tension in Newtons and the x-axis represents angle θ in radians. The original poster expresses confusion regarding the use of natural logarithms and how this affects the calculation of slope.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the calculation of slope using natural logarithms and question the implications of having a dimensionless value divided by radians. There is a focus on understanding the meaning of the slope in relation to the physical quantity μ.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided clarifications regarding the use of natural logs and the interpretation of slope. However, concerns remain about the dimensionality of the slope and its representation in the context of the problem.

Contextual Notes

There is an ongoing discussion about the nature of radians as a unit and its relationship to the dimensionless values being used in the slope calculation. The original poster's understanding of natural logs and their application in the problem is still developing.

seanmyers23
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Homework Statement


In a physics lab we were finding slope on semi-log graph paper, with the y (up) axis representing tension in Newtons, and the x (sideways) axis representing θ in radians. Sadly, the prof introduced the new concept of natural logs to me - I'd never heard of these until this day. He told us to use the natural logs of the y coordinates to find rise, and I have next to know idea what this means, other than pushing the ln button prior to inputting a number in my calculator. What I'm trying to find is not only how to do the natural logs, but also what unit my answer for slope will be in. Any help would be appreciated.

Homework Equations





The Attempt at a Solution


If rise/run = y2 - y1/ x2 - x1, my equation looked like this: 5.00N - 9.67N/ 13∏/4 - 5∏4. This seems like complete nonsense to me.
 
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seanmyers23 said:

Homework Statement


In a physics lab we were finding slope on semi-log graph paper, with the y (up) axis representing tension in Newtons, and the x (sideways) axis representing θ in radians. Sadly, the prof introduced the new concept of natural logs to me - I'd never heard of these until this day. He told us to use the natural logs of the y coordinates to find rise, and I have next to know idea what this means, other than pushing the ln button prior to inputting a number in my calculator. What I'm trying to find is not only how to do the natural logs, but also what unit my answer for slope will be in. Any help would be appreciated.

Homework Equations





The Attempt at a Solution


If rise/run = y2 - y1/ x2 - x1, my equation looked like this: 5.00N - 9.67N/ 13∏/4 - 5∏4. This seems like complete nonsense to me.

Natural logs are just logarithms to the base e =2.718 rather than 10. The natural log of a number is just the power that you have to raise 2.718 to in order to get the number. Just like logs to the base 10, logs to the base e are such that ln(AB) = ln(A) + ln(B). In your problem, if T is the tension, and you are evaluating he slope over the θ interval from T1 to T2, the slope on this "semilog" plot is given by:

slope = ( ln(T2) - ln(T1) )/(θ2 - θ1)

but ln(T2) - ln(T1) = ln(T2/T1)

so, slope = ln(T2/T1)/(θ2 - θ1)

The units of the ratio T2/T1 are dimensionless, and, for small tension changes, ln (T2/T1) can be interpreted is the fractional change in the tension form θ1 to θ2.

I hope this helps.
 
Thanks, that did help a bit, but I'm still concerned about having a dimensionless value divided by radians...in this case, our slope is supposed to represent μ, which from my understanding does not have any units. So does this mean that radians isn't really a unit either?
 
seanmyers23 said:
Thanks, that did help a bit, but I'm still concerned about having a dimensionless value divided by radians...in this case, our slope is supposed to represent μ, which from my understanding does not have any units. So does this mean that radians isn't really a unit either?

Yes.
 
Great, thanks a lot.
 

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