Visualizing the space and structure described by a metric

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around visualizing the geometry described by a metric in a three-dimensional Euclidean space, particularly focusing on the transformation of surfaces defined by fixed coordinates. Participants explore the implications of changing coordinate systems and how these changes affect the shapes of surfaces, such as the transition from spheres to ellipsoids.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks help visualizing the geometry and questions why the surface of fixed radius becomes an ellipsoid.
  • Another participant explains that the change in coordinate system alters the surfaces from spheres to ellipsoids, providing equations to illustrate this transformation.
  • There is a query about how a parameter affects only horizontal dimensions while keeping the vertical dimension constant, leading to a discussion about the meaning of "squashed" in this context.
  • Participants clarify that the z-coordinate does not depend on the parameter affecting the horizontal dimensions, and they refine the definition of "squashed" to mean reduced height rather than zero height.
  • One participant uses an analogy of an ant on a sphere to explain how changes in one coordinate can be visualized, suggesting that squashing the sphere to flatness resembles viewing a fully inflated sphere from above.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of the coordinate transformations and the meanings of terms like "squashed." While some points are clarified, the discussion remains unresolved regarding the full implications of these transformations and the roles of the coordinates.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the importance of understanding the fixed nature of certain coordinates and how this affects the visualization of the geometry. There are unresolved questions about the dependence of the z-coordinate on the parameters involved.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for individuals interested in geometric visualization, coordinate transformations, and the implications of metric changes in three-dimensional spaces, particularly in the context of physics and mathematics.

Whitehole
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I need help to visualize the geometry involved here,

Image.jpg


How can I visualize the last paragraph? Why is the surface of fixed r now an ellipsoid? Also for r = 0, it is already a disk? I've tried searching for the geometry of these but I can't find any image of the geometry that I can just stare at and understand already what the paragraph meant. Anybody can give me insights?
 
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Bear in mind that these machinations do not change the space, which remains 3D Euclidean. All they change is the coordinate system, so that the surfaces defined by fixing a coordinate change.
In spherical coordinates in flat space the surfaces of fixed coordinates are:
- spheres centred on the origin for fixed ##r##
- cones around the z axis with tip at the origin, for fixed ##\theta##
- half planes emanating from the z axis, for fixed ##\phi##

The change above alters the first of these so that the spheres become ellipsoids. You can see that must be the case because of the equations:
$$x=f\sin\theta\cos\phi$$
$$y=f\sin\theta\sin\phi$$
$$z=r\sin\theta\cos\phi$$
If ##f=r## these are the equations of a sphere of radius ##r##. If ##a\neq 0## than ##f=\sqrt{a^2+r^2}>r## so the horizontal dimensions ##x,y## are expanded while keeping the vertical dimension ##z## constant. That squashes the sphere into an oblate spheroid.
 
andrewkirk said:
Bear in mind that these machinations do not change the space, which remains 3D Euclidean. All they change is the coordinate system, so that the surfaces defined by fixing a coordinate change.
In spherical coordinates in flat space the surfaces of fixed coordinates are:
- spheres centred on the origin for fixed ##r##
- cones around the z axis with tip at the origin, for fixed ##\theta##
- half planes emanating from the z axis, for fixed ##\phi##

The change above alters the first of these so that the spheres become ellipsoids. You can see that must be the case because of the equations:
$$x=f\sin\theta\cos\phi$$
$$y=f\sin\theta\sin\phi$$
$$z=r\sin\theta\cos\phi$$
If ##f=r## these are the equations of a sphere of radius ##r##. If ##a\neq 0## than ##f=\sqrt{a^2+r^2}>r## so the horizontal dimensions ##x,y## are expanded while keeping the vertical dimension ##z## constant. That squashes the sphere into an oblate spheroid.
How can ##a## only alter the horizontal dimensions, ##r## is a 3-d coordinate here so it should affect the z component if it were to change right? Also, is the term squashed sphere accurate? Because squashed means that the z coordinate is decreasing and eventually flat, correct me if I'm wrong.
 
Whitehole said:
How can a only alter the horizontal dimensions, r is a 3-d coordinate here so it should affect the z component if it were to change right?
No. I think you are confusing yourself by using the term '3D coordinate'. Look at the formulas for x, y and z. You can see that only the x and y formulas use f, which depends on a. z uses r instead of f, and hence has no dependence on a.
Whitehole said:
squashed means that the z coordinate is decreasing and eventually flat, correct me if I'm wrong.
No, squashed doesn't mean having zero height. It just means having less height than it had previously.
 
andrewkirk said:
No. I think you are confusing yourself by using the term '3D coordinate'. Look at the formulas for x, y and z. You can see that only the x and y formulas use f, which depends on a. z uses r instead of f, and hence has no dependence on a.

No, squashed doesn't mean having zero height. It just means having less height than it had previously.
Now I got it, I didn't carefully saw the "fixed r". Also, yes, specifically squashed means having less height than it had previously. For the last part, how can ##θ## play the role of the radial variable if it is already flat? ##φ## sweeps out the disk from 0 to 2π. But ##θ## . . .
 
Think about what it looks like when you view an ant crawling about on the Northern hemisphere of an origin-centred sphere from above it on the z axis, eg viewing the unit sphere from the point (0,0,10).
Changes in the ant's ##\theta##, keeping ##r## and ##\phi## constant, will look like increases or decreases in radius.
Squashing the sphere down to absolutely flat, which is what the set r=0 is, looks the same as viewing a 'fully inflated' sphere from above.
 
andrewkirk said:
Think about what it looks like when you view an ant crawling about on the Northern hemisphere of an origin-centred sphere from above it on the z axis, eg viewing the unit sphere from the point (0,0,10).
Changes in the ant's ##\theta##, keeping ##r## and ##\phi## constant, will look like increases or decreases in radius.
Squashing the sphere down to absolutely flat, which is what the set r=0 is, looks the same as viewing a 'fully inflated' sphere from above.
Very nice example. Thanks a lot for helping me visualize all this!
 

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