What Are the Advantages of Using SVG for Web Design?

[Nylex]

I'm using Mozilla 1.7.5, since it came with Slackware. If it didn't, I probably would be using Firefox .

 

[hitssquad]

http://www.windowsitpro.com/Article/ArticleID/47208/47208.html

"My advice is simple: Boycott IE. It's a cancer on the Web that must be stopped. IE isn't secure [...]

google.com/search?q=%22firefox+is+not+secure%22

 

[hitssquad]

What security is engineered into Firefox that is not in IE

Some of IE's Vulnerabilies have been there forever.

Firefox is less vulnerable than IE? What might make it less vulnerable?

 

[Monique]

Actually I downloaded the new version of firefox a few days ago, I think it still works crappy so switched back to IE. I've never had a virus/worm/trojan, so why step down.

 

[EL]

So I just finished installing Firefox. It works fine except for one anoying thing: The scroll on my touchpad doesn't work! (In IE it still works fine...)

 

[dduardo]

The only official date so far for IE7 is the concurrent release with Windows Vista, so SP2 is irrelevant.

Ok, so another year until Vista gets into the public if it doesn't get delayed again, then another 4/5 years for the majority to adopt. Now we are going on 5/6 years before we can start using technology which is available today. If they would atleast unbundled IE7, adoption would speed up, but no, they want to force you into an upgrade of their operating system.

google.com/search?q=%22firefox+is+not+secure%22

Now your just spreading FUD. This is type of junk that comes up when you do that type of search:

"Firefox is NOT secure...
According to my rep, Microsoft's official position is that Open Source software is not secure."

Let me bring your attention to some hard evidence which mattmns already posted:

http://secunia.com/product/11/
http://secunia.com/product/4227/

Actually I downloaded the new version of firefox a few days ago, I think it still works crappy so switched back to IE. I've never had a virus/worm/trojan, so why step down.

O no, the scrollbar is not flush to the screen edge and I don't have a mouse with a scroll wheel. What a crappy product. Let me run back to technically inferior software.

So I just finished installing Firefox. It works fine except for one anoying thing: The scroll on my touchpad doesn't work! (In IE it still works fine...)

What model laptop do you have?

------------------

Microsoft has you people in its tight vice grip. You have no idea how far behind Windows is in terms of technology. You will continue to be drop fed improvements while you fill up Microsoft's pockets. It just sickens me to see people consistently go for the worse product.

When Vista comes out and Microsoft touts its transparent window borders as innovative just remember that it has already been done for many years:

http://fvwm-themes.sourceforge.net/screenshots/full/transparent.png

And when you see Vista do searches for your documents, just remember these where around before:

http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/spotlight/
http://beaglewiki.org/Main_Page

And when you see Vista able to switch between users, especially to admin/root, inside a current user session, just remember unix did it back in the 1970s

http://unixhelp.ed.ac.uk/CGI/man-cgi?su+1

And when you see Vista able to filter network traffic better, just remember iptables/ipchains and ipfw

http://www.netfilter.org/
http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a/bsd/2001/04/25/FreeBSD_Basics.html

And when Vista tries to shoves DRM down your throat, don't come back and complain that you can't transfer/record/edit your music or movies.

 

[gerben]

Actually I downloaded the new version of firefox a few days ago, I think it still works crappy so switched back to IE. I've never had a virus/worm/trojan, so why step down.

I do not understand what you mean with "works crappy" and with with "stepping down".

 

[Monique]

O no, the scrollbar is not flush to the screen edge and I don't have a mouse with a scroll wheel. What a crappy product. Let me run back to technically inferior software.

That's Firefox's problem, not mine. As I said, I've never had a problem with IE and have a list of problems with Firefox so I choose the one that works for me.

 

[hitssquad]

Firefox is less vulnerable than IE? What might make it less vulnerable?

Let me bring your attention to some hard evidence which mattmns already posted:

http://secunia.com/product/11/
http://secunia.com/product/4227/

Is Firefox more secure than IE? If so, what features make it more secure?

 

[Moonbear]

Ok, so another year until Vista gets into the public if it doesn't get delayed again, then another 4/5 years for the majority to adopt. Now we are going on 5/6 years before we can start using technology which is available today. If they would atleast unbundled IE7, adoption would speed up, but no, they want to force you into an upgrade of their operating system.

This is the part that really bothers me about Microsoft. In any other business, if a supplier ships a product that's defective, they are expected to fix it or refund your money. But, Microsoft expects you to pay to replace the defective product with another only slightly less defective product. In my mind, upgrades should not need to be done to fix bugs. Upgrades should be done because new features are introduced, speed is enhanced, etc.; something that wasn't required for the functionality of the previous version, but you'd really like to have anyway and wonder how you went all those years without it once you have it.

IE lags behind even further on Macs. I think the current version of IE for Macs is still 5.2. I don't know if the numbering system is consistent between platforms though...is that the same as IE 6 for Windows, or IE 5? Fortunately, all new Macs come with Safari.

 

[hitssquad]

google.com/search?q=%22firefox+is+not+secure%22

Now your just spreading FUD. This is type of junk that comes up when you do that type of search:

"Firefox is NOT secure...
According to my rep, Microsoft's official position is that Open Source software is not secure."

That is from a parody written by a Firefox fan. Here is the whole text of that parody:
http://news.zdnet.com/5208-1009-0.html?forumID=1&threadID=11790&messageID=234741&start=7

--
Firefox is NOT secure...
According to my rep, Microsoft's official position is that Open Source software is not secure. My firm has adopted Microsoft's Trustworthy Computing initiative 100%. My rep and I held a conference here where I read the riot act to users in order to scare them into keeping security in the forefront of their minds when using computers. I have told my CEO that for regulatory purposes, I am now blocking access to web sites running Apache. One of my most brilliant MCSD's wrote a plug-in for ISA Server which detects what web server a site is running. If it is not IIS, it is blocked. Period, end of story. My rep has thanked me for my contributions to trust worthy computing over and over again. We are also in line to have Roberta Bragg visit us PERSONALLY and extoll the virtues of her new book about Microsoft security. This is truly a banner time for me and my rep. My rep and I celebrated over breakfast this morning. We both toasted my vision. As my rep says, "networks can only be secure running one OS on one platform". Truer words were never uttered.
Posted by: Mike Cox Posted on: 07/13/05
--

 

[EL]

What model laptop do you have?

HP Compaq nc6220

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

This is the part that really bothers me about Microsoft. In any other business, if a supplier ships a product that's defective, they are expected to fix it or refund your money. But, Microsoft expects you to pay to replace the defective product with another only slightly less defective product. In my mind, upgrades should not need to be done to fix bugs. Upgrades should be done because new features are introduced, speed is enhanced, etc.; something that wasn't required for the functionality of the previous version, but you'd really like to have anyway and wonder how you went all those years without it once you have it.

This is not just Microsoft. This is every computer software company. There isn't one piece of software that doesn't contain bugs at final release. In todays world it is impossible to expect a package to be bug free with all the complexities software companies have to face. Also Microsoft has released a lot of patches for IE. The problem is IE6 is nearly 6 years old. They should have had a brand new browser out 3-4 years ago.

 

[JamesU]

I am using MIE right noe ( ) but on my computer, I switched to firefox. much better

 

[rocketboy]

What's internet explorer?

firefox all the way.

 

[JamesU]

internet explorer is a primative web browser. no protection, and javascript errors as far as the eye could see

 

[mattmns]

Is Firefox more secure than IE? If so, what features make it more secure?

I do not develop firefox so I could not say for sure. Some things that come to mind though are:

1) Firefox is not built into the operating system, unlike IE which is (for windows). This means, imo, that if you have a problem in IE it can screw up your entire system.

http://www.kb.cert.org/vuls/id/713878">There are a number of significant vulnerabilities in technologies relating to the IE domain/zone security model, local file system (Local Machine Zone) trust, the Dynamic HTML (DHTML) document object model (in particular, proprietary DHTML features), the HTML Help system, MIME type determination, the graphical user interface (GUI), and ActiveX. … IE is integrated into Windows to such an extent that vulnerabilities in IE frequently provide an attacker significant access to the operating system.

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticisms_of_Internet_Explorer


2) Active X: Firefox does not have Active X, and imo, that alone is a nice feature. Active X seems to be a big problem with IE and I think is the source for a lot of spyware, ad-ware, etc.

Microsoft has recognized the problem with ActiveX since 1996 when Charles Fitzgerald, program manager of Microsoft's Java team said "If you want security on the 'Net', unplug your computer. ... We never made the claim up front that ActiveX is intrinsically secure."

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_X

 

[dduardo]

HP Compaq nc6220

Sorry, couldn't find any people having issues with firefox on this laptop. Must be a driver issue.

This is not just Microsoft. This is every computer software company. There isn't one piece of software that doesn't contain bugs at final release. In todays world it is impossible to expect a package to be bug free with all the complexities software companies have to face. Also Microsoft has released a lot of patches for IE. The problem is IE6 is nearly 6 years old. They should have had a brand new browser out 3-4 years ago.

Your right, software is complicated stuff. The issue I have with Microsoft is that they've waited too long to release a new Windows/IE. Look at Apple's release cycle, they've had 4 releases since the arrival of OSX 10.0 in 2001. They are constantly updating their software and improving safari. It is even said that in their current CVS safari passes the ACID2 test. So hopefully will see this improvement in Leopard OSX 10.5. Microsoft on the other hand has been dragging the industry along with its antiquated technology and resistence to make major changes to IE. Microsoft better have one hell of an operating system if it took them nearly 5 years to complete. If any other software company would have tried to pull this type of stunt they would surely filed for bankrupcy.

 

[hitssquad]

2) Active X: Firefox does not have Active X

IE also does not have Active X if it is not turned on. Alternately, in IE, five different aspects of Active X can be individually selected On, Off, or set to Prompt.

 

[mattmns]

IE also does not have Active X if it is not turned on. Alternately, in IE, five different aspects of Active X can be individually selected On, Off, or set to Prompt.

Yes, and if you were to go a few steps further and disable IE altogether, there would probably be no security issues with IE at all.

 

[motai]

What exactly are some good reasons to switch to Firefox? I've been using IE for years and haven't had a problem, and looking at the Firefox website implies that the only advantages for switching are tabbed browsing and security fixes (and W3C implementation). I already have my handy Google toolbar, so I don't have to worry about popups or searching. IE can be occasionally buggy, but on this machine it isn't too much of a problem (as in I am not trying to smash the computer with a jackhammer). Why change?

If Firefox is as good as other open-source projects like Wikipedia, I'll try it. Even if it matches the accessibility of programs like http://www.trillian.cc (okay, this isn't open-source, but its cool anyway), which is far better than AIM or MSN (but combines the functionable aspects of it and ICQ/IRC/Yahoo).

I'm not just speaking on behalf of myself, but also for the other stubborn IE users out there.

 

[hitssquad]

I've been using IE for years and haven't had a problem

If that is the case, according to the Firefox Manifesto you must either have been hallucinating or are a member of the owner-class.

 

[Moonbear]

If that is the case, according to the Firefox Manifesto you must either have been hallucinating or are a member of the owner-class.

 

[mattmns]

What exactly are some good reasons to switch to Firefox? I've been using IE for years and haven't had a problem, and looking at the Firefox website implies that the only advantages for switching are tabbed browsing and security fixes (and W3C implementation). I already have my handy Google toolbar, so I don't have to worry about popups or searching. IE can be occasionally buggy, but on this machine it isn't too much of a problem (as in I am not trying to smash the computer with a jackhammer). Why change?

If Firefox is as good as other open-source projects like Wikipedia, I'll try it. Even if it matches the accessibility of programs like http://www.trillian.cc (okay, this isn't open-source, but its cool anyway), which is far better than AIM or MSN (but combines the functionable aspects of it and ICQ/IRC/Yahoo).

I'm not just speaking on behalf of myself, but also for the other stubborn IE users out there.

Don't limit yourself to firefox, or open-source, try out Opera too. As for firefox being a good open-source project. I would say it is probably the best open-source project currently out. You have nothing to lose when you are trying firefox. Unless, of course, you fall into the category of having MS stock (a few PF members fall into this category, imo): If this is the case, you should probably join the local ban firefox/open-source-projects club.

 

[EL]

Sorry, couldn't find any people having issues with firefox on this laptop. Must be a driver issue.

Probably. Thanks anyway...

 

[mattmns]

Probably. Thanks anyway...

This may seem silly: Go to tools-> options, I think (edit -> preferences in linux). Click on the advanced section (at the bottom). Then look at browsing. Do you have those buttons enabled (use autoscrolling, use smoothscrolling)? Try those if you don't.

 

[outsider]

Looks like I'm out of touch... can all you FOX supporters explain to me why I would want to do this? Does anyone run both browsers to compare (i'm guessing someone must)? Thank you.

 

[brewnog]

I've never had a problem with IE either. However, I don't think that's a good enough reason not to try something else. Since reading this thread, I've bunged Firefox on. So far, so good...


Oooh, and I've got a nice Google toolbar for it too now! Woo!

 

[mattmns]

I am not sure what you are into, but trying out firefox is definitely worth the time imo. Firefox, with a bit of figuring out can do pretty much anything, and I mean anything, you want it to do. Check out www.getfirefox.com it has a list of some of firefox's main features. Also, check out the list of extensions, these allow you to do much, much, more.

Some of my favorite features.

-Tabs, these are a must. (For IE there is a program called crazy browser, but I have not used it in almost 2 years, so I am unsure of whether or not it is as good as firefox's tabs)
-Keyword bookmarks and searches.
-Adblocking css (you can block out 99.9% of ads with a simple css (text) file. I think it now comes with firefox by default [if it does not I could post mine]).
-Limitless customization.
-Mouse Gestures [extension] (Opera's are much much better though imo)
-FoxyTunes [extension] (allows you to control your favorite media player inside your firefox browser window).

If you can't figure something out, or are wondering if something is possible in firefox, check out the mozillazine firefox forums at http://forums.mozillazine.org/


If you are going to try firefox give it a real try. Use nothing but firefox for a week, check out the mozillazine firefox forums (http://forums.mozillazine.org/) if you have questions or want to see what other people have done, check out the extensions, the themes, etc. If you just install the base you are missing out on some great features.


edit... also check out http://www.mozilla.org/support/firefox/tips

 

[Monique]

I've found a theme that works well for me: 'Scribblies kids' and I changed my touchpad configuration to help the usability. I'll download the mouse gestures and see how they work.

It's weird how the url bar works as as a Google 'I'm feeling lucky bar' instead of a bookmarked pages bar with keywords, but that takes getting used to.

 

[mattmns]

I've found a theme that works well for me: 'Scribblies kids' and I changed my touchpad configuration to help the usability. I'll download the mouse gestures and see how they work.

It's weird how the url bar works as as a Google 'I'm feeling lucky bar' instead of a bookmarked pages bar with keywords, but that takes getting used to.

Yeah, but sometimes you can use it to your advantage

Also, if your know the site you are going to is a .com you can type in say "google" (without the quotes) and press "ctrl+enter" and it will add the .com and take you to "google.com"

You can also do this with .org

.com = ctrl+enter
.org = shift+enter

 

[dduardo]

Definitely likely the mouse gestures. Can't wait until Firefox 1.5 to use Easy Gesture:

https://addons.mozilla.org/extensions/moreinfo.php?id=29

Although I guess I could download Deer Park Alpha 2 to try it now.

 

[mattmns]

Are those easy gestures that good? I may have to try them out. I have only tried the all-in-one gestures, which work great in windows, and ok in linux.

 

[dduardo]

I haven't tried easy gestures. The one I'm using now is here:

http://optimoz.mozdev.org/

Works great in linux.

 

[mattmns]

Those are the ones I have had trouble with in linux (iirc, all in one gestures is a combo of opimoz gestures with a few extra features). I even filed a bug report, iirc. The problem I have is that sometimes after closing a tab I will have a huge selection highlighted on the next page. Here is my bug report: http://mozdev.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=9961 Do you not have this problem?

 

[motai]

Alright you all, you win. :shy: I downloaded Firefox and it is acting very much like IE would. It looks a little bland though... how would I go abouts customizing it, and what can be changed?

 

[dduardo]

They are going to tell you to upgrade to version 1.0.1 and use firefox 1.06

 

[dduardo]

Alright you all, you win. :shy: I downloaded Firefox and it is acting very much like IE would. It looks a little bland though... how would I go abouts customizing it, and what can be changed?

Tools->themes
Tools->extensions

At the bottom right of the window you'll see a link for Get new [themes/extensions]

motai, remember, Ctrl+t = new tab

 

[mattmns]

I am guessing you are referring to me dduardo? I posted that bug report in April 2005. I have not had any response though.

 

[motai]

Tools->themes
Tools->extensions

At the bottom right of the window you'll see a link for Get new [themes/extensions]

That was fast. Thanks.

 

[dduardo]

I am guessing you are referring to me dduardo? I posted that bug report in April 2005. I have not had any response though.

I don't know what to say. It doesn't happen to me.

 

[Learning Curve]

Firefox is so simple, why not use it?

 

[Moonbear]

So, someone replied to the poll with "other." What "other" browser is out there? Will whoever clicked that one speak up and share?

 

[mattmns]

So, someone replied to the poll with "other." What "other" browser is out there? Will whoever clicked that one speak up and share?

Maybe Nylex?

I'm using Mozilla 1.7.5, since it came with Slackware. If it didn't, I probably would be using Firefox .

Other browsers that I can think of: Galeon, Konqueror, Netscape.

 

[dduardo]

Lynx!

 

[Moonbear]

Ah, I missed Nylex's post. I didn't realize there were so many browsers to choose from! Competition is good.

 

[rocketboy]

A really nice Firefox theme is Noia 2.0. It's really clean and has nice animated buttons. It also is a little bit more colourful and interesting than the default skin/theme. Check it out https://addons.mozilla.org/themes/moreinfo.php?id=72&application=firefox .

 

[*Kia*]

Which browser do you use? If your using IE you should consider switching to firefox:

http://www.mozilla.org/

Why?

I have IE, Firefox, Netscape and Opera installed (to test my webpages).
IE has more functions, better usability, and many of my special effects and scripts are not understood by browsers such as firefox, meaning extra coding so these browsers do not misinterpret them.

When other browsers catch up and look and feel less chunky and childlike then maybe...

 

[*Kia*]

I hear Microsoft is trying to make a big step with IE7. Tabbed browsing, "real security"... some other crap... probably won't work so I am sticken with Da Fox.

"IE7" is a whole new project and not Internet Explorer 7

 

[*Kia*]

You get to use "special stuff"? Did not you say a while ago that your IE at work does not even have tabs? Tabs in the sense of firefox's tabs, not tasbar buttons

Those tabs are NASTY, icky icky icky no thankeee