What are the financial implications of marriage for wealthy couples?

[lisab]

That's my issue. Like you said, you have responsibilities. The unmarried person would not need legal obligations, or need to be responsible to do things for their partner, they would do it because of their strong intimated relationship and NOT because they're married and have to.

Unless you take legal steps to give your partner the powers that marriage automatically grants, you won't be able to take on those responsibilities, even if you really want to, no matter how strong and intimate your relationship is.

And if you do take those legal steps...well, a rose by any other name, is still a rose...

 

[Laura1013]

That's my issue. Like you said, you have responsibilities. The unmarried person would not need legal obligations, or need to be responsible to do things for their partner, they would do it because of their strong intimated relationship and NOT because they're married and have to.

Maybe responsibility isn't the right word – privilege? Unmarried, unrelated people do not have the legal authority to make those decisions (in the U.S.), unless they are appointed Power of Attorney.

 

[Astronuc]

You're assuming that this intimated relationship can only be achieved through marriage and that marriage is the most intimate relationship between two human beings.

Marriage IS the most intimate relationship between two human beings, or it should be, in terms of knowing the other person. Of course, we must acknowledge that at least 50% of marriages fail (at least in the US) because at least one party is not committed to the relationship.

When I refer to marriage, I refer to the committed relationship between two persons who make that commitment, rather than the legal institution.

I 'married' my wife the first time I slept with her (using a common euphemism), because by the standards I impose upon myself, I became bound to her for a lifetime (as long as both of us shall live).

 

[P4PPY]

I was married for 9 years. I learned one thing. You have no control over another human being.

Don't think for a second that anyone person will be with you for ever and ever. The marriage contract is nothing more than your 'faith' in paper form.

The fact that you can get divorced for under $100 (US) makes it very easy to up and bail when things get tough, or when someone you are married too changes due to age, career or children.

To me, I think marriage is more about raising children. Providing a more stable environment for a child can help them grow up to respect their surrounding and the people in them.

But since both parents generally work now, it really doesn't matter. Your child will spend 1/2 of his/her day being raised by teachers, babysitters & next door neighbors.

I think marriage is great for people who are over 50. As for me... I enjoying playing too much :)

 

[Chi Meson]

I think some people here are confusing the wedding with the marriage. The wedding is simply the start of the marriage, and not so important in the long run. The marriage is everything afterwards.

I agree, but I don't even think of our wedding as the "start" of our marriage. We had been together for over a year before that point. The marriage was just an excuse to invite all our friends to a big party that our parents were overjoyed to pay for.

 

[Chi Meson]

I think marriage is great for people who are over 50. As for me... I enjoying playing too much :)

Just as long as Pappy ain't a poppa before then!

 

[P4PPY]

I have a 6 year old daughter, and I'm a single parent.

As soon as Samantha was born... I got fixed :)

I plan on raising her with a realist perspective.

She says, "HEY!" by the way.

 

[lisab]

I agree, but I don't even think of our wedding as the "start" of our marriage. We had been together for over a year before that point. The marriage was just an excuse to invite all our friends to a big party that our parents were overjoyed to pay for.

I was dreading my wedding! All the planning, the details...those kinds of things are not my strong suit. I don't even like weddings, with all the fuss. I floated the idea to my mom that we should just elope. She suggested instead that she would take care of all the planning. She loves planning events!

So I just showed up, literally. When I got to my wedding, I didn't have the slightest idea what to expect. I learned my "theme color" was blue, the flowers were yellow roses (my hubby's from Texas), the meal was salmon... My mom was happy as a clam and so was I!

 

[Astronuc]

My father, who is a minister, officiated at my wedding. My wife's made her dress. I bought a new suit of reasonable quality. My dad used his connections and made arrangements with a small private chapel, and we had about 30 family members and close friends, some of whom played guitar for us. We had the reception at the home of a couple, my best friend was living with my wife's best friend.

Since my wife and I were going into grad school, we didn't go on a honeymoon (trip/vaction) but saved our money for tuition and living expenses. I had saved up enough money, and my wife and I worked during grad school, so that we payed off her student loans and bought my wife a new car. Toward the end of grad school, we decided to have kids, and I left a PhD program to get a job and support a family.

I've been with the same woman for 27 years, and she has been my one and only intimate partner my whole life.

 

[P4PPY]

I've been with the same woman for 27 years, and she has been my one and only intimate partner my whole life.

WHOA!

 

[tgt]

I 'married' my wife the first time I slept with her (using a common euphemism), because by the standards I impose upon myself, I became bound to her for a lifetime (as long as both of us shall live).

Was she the first and only person you have slept with?

Did you marry her then sleep with her or vice versa? And why?

 

[lisab]

Was she the first and only person you have slept with?

Did you marry her then sleep with her or vice versa? And why?

Jeez, tgt, that's pretty personal!

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

I 'married' my wife the first time I slept with her (using a common euphemism).

Common indeed.
Father (holding shotgun): Did you sleep with my daughter?
Boyfriend (heading for the hills): No sir, not a wink.

 

[Moonbear]

Unless you take legal steps to give your partner the powers that marriage automatically grants, you won't be able to take on those responsibilities, even if you really want to, no matter how strong and intimate your relationship is.

And if you do take those legal steps...well, a rose by any other name, is still a rose...

Maybe responsibility isn't the right word – privilege? Unmarried, unrelated people do not have the legal authority to make those decisions (in the U.S.), unless they are appointed Power of Attorney.

Yes, that was the point I tried to make earlier. I don't really see marriage as a necessity for the affection and commitment...you should be able to accomplish that regardless of legal status. Rather, I see marriage as a whole lot easier way of establishing a bunch of legal contracts all bundled into one simple license fee and marriage certificate rather than needing to go out and fill out a half dozen or more individual legal documents and pay an attorney to make sure they're all done right to accomplish the same thing...not because you need it to bind your partner to you, but you need it to ensure THEY have the right to make the decisions you want them to be able to make, and no other relatives can butt their noses in and take those rights away from them.

That's actually a difficult thing about getting old enough to realize you're mortal while still single...you have to start thinking about things like assigning power of attorney to someone you really trust to make decisions on your behalf should you wind up unconscious after a bad car accident, for example. Having a spouse automatically gives them that responsibility for you should something like that happen, because it's assumed that the spouse is the person you trust enough to share your life with and who knows you better than all other people.

I think it's nonsense to say it changes your whole relationship in terms of any sort of affection though...relationships evolve over time naturally, but I don't see how a marriage has anything to do with it. That affection ought to be there before the marriage, and ought to still be there after the marriage, and the marriage itself is just an easy way of signing one document to settle things in the legal realm.

 

[Noone]

The hole point of marriage

Is to find some one that you really like and want to spend the rest of your time on this Earth with, then you plan ahead to make a wedding, the point of a wedding is to plan a day long trip or longer ahead of time before you go into it, to have the most fun and be as happy as you could be. Then there's the other concepts of what it mean's to the person undergoing it, this depends on the people and there back round, and traditions that they uphold. But in the past when it was first started, the whole point was to bond or mark your other in life, till the day you die :D but there are far to meany points of view of what marriage means, its just like the word love, has diffrent meanings to other people depending on the view of what it is. But it's true that religion has played a big role on the words that you recite when you under go the ritual.

 

[Noone]

Moonbear it totaly right... it isn't needed.. but people that don't under go the ritual, other people would have a harmfull perception of the actions that they do...

people lack a common understanding of what is needed and what is a false need

 

[Noone]

I will reframe from using the names of the organizeations that would have a harmfull perception of the peoples action's. But I am sure it doesn't need to be pointed out :D

allso if there heart and love is in the right spot, they will be togeather till the day they die, without having the ritual done. they would just do they own ritual that would mean a lot more to them, than one that was created by other's to simbolize there ever-lasting-bond of love. *a Tip* cut out the middle man :D it would be cheaper, and i think that would even make you more happy :)

 

[Noone]

people also like marriage now aday's for the benfit of filling out there taxes

 

[Noone]

what a nice added bonus :D spend a little make a little, doesn't that cramp on the hole concept of why people get hiched? well it tends to be a varriable in why they do. One of meany.

 

[Chi Meson]

I have a 6 year old daughter, and I'm a single parent.

As soon as Samantha was born... I got fixed :)

I plan on raising her with a realist perspective.

She says, "HEY!" by the way.

Nell says "Hi." She's about to turn 7. Simon (http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g254/brichid1765/PF uploads/SiMeson.jpg) is now 5, and Benny (on my shoulders there) is 3.

I got fixed too after Benny.

 

[lisab]

Nell says "Hi." She's about to turn 7. Simon (http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g254/brichid1765/PF uploads/SiMeson.jpg) is now 5, and Benny (on my shoulders there) is 3.

I got fixed too after Benny.

Simon looks like a Super Hero!

Very cute kid, Chi.

 

[P4PPY]

Cute kids man!

I stopped at 1... that was all I could handle :)

 

[lisab]

I stopped at one, also.

For my hubby and me, one was a compromise between "none" and "some."

Now at 15 she's wanting to go to a private college. That will cost us about $100,000, we figure . I am SO very glad we stopped at one!

 

[P4PPY]

Be thankful she 'wants' to go to college :)

Sounds like it's time to start hunting for grants huh?

 

[ice109]

i got a better question: what's the point of commitment

 

[Cyrus]

Nell says "Hi." She's about to turn 7. Simon (http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g254/brichid1765/PF uploads/SiMeson.jpg) is now 5, and Benny (on my shoulders there) is 3.

I got fixed too after Benny.

Ha, that's my man simon. He looks awesome in this picture. He reminds me of Bono.

 

[Cyrus]

I stopped at one, also.

For my hubby and me, one was a compromise between "none" and "some."

Now at 15 she's wanting to go to a private college. That will cost us about $100,000, we figure . I am SO very glad we stopped at one!

Thats when you and your husband look at her in the eye, look at each other, then look at her again and bust out laughing. No way would I make my parents pay for private college that would cost $100k, nor would I pay for my kids to go to such a college. Its not worth it. The only place worth that kind of money is Harvard, Stanford, MIT, Yale or Princeton.

 

[JasonRox]

i got a better question: what's the point of commitment

Insecurity?

I'm seeing someone and if she wanted to start dated someone else, I'm totally fine with that. I would barely flinch.

Commitment later on may be beneficial I guess (I don't really know), but I think now is time to date not commit.

 

[Astronuc]

i got a better question: what's the point of commitment

Sustainability.

Commitment is ongoing. Long term marriages, e.g. those that last 40-50-60-70 years, i.e. basically until one partner dies, are simply a product of the commitment and effort of the two parties involved.

 

[lisab]

Thats when you and your husband look at her in the eye, look at each other, then look at her again and bust out laughing. No way would I make my parents pay for private college that would cost $100k, nor would I pay for my kids to go to such a college. Its not worth it. The only place worth that kind of money is Harvard, Stanford, MIT, Yale or Princeton.

You'll be able to make those decisions for your family when you have one. We can afford it because we both earn good wages and only have one kid.

Fact is, when you add up what you would be paying for room and board if your family wasn't willing to provide, that's about what they're saving you.

 

[Cyrus]

You'll be able to make those decisions for your family when you have one. We can afford it because we both earn good wages and only have one kid.

Fact is, when you add up what you would be paying for room and board if your family wasn't willing to provide, that's about what they're saving you.

You're right. I never realized room and board, plus tuition, adds up to nearly 80k for in state tuition. So then if your daughter was looking at a private school that costs $30k a year, it will be in excess of 180k. Thats nuts!


I think my total undergrad education cost my parents just under $30k.

I always paid for my books myself, and that was probably another 5k+. I know each semester cost me 1k in books.

 

[lisab]

When I look at what students pay in books these days, I can't believe I used to complain about $30 textbooks!

 

[Cyrus]

At work, I noticed everyone had every single textbook on their shelf from college. I realized how valuable they were, and how people were absolutely WRONG to sell them back. Thats why I always bought a used book that had NO markings inside of it. If I couldn't find one used that was in mint condition, I would pony up the money and buy it brand new. If you open any of my books you won't find a single thing in them except for a few underlines with highlighter (made by following a straight edge). No slop, anywhere.

 

[Chi Meson]

I got to say that if any of our kids decide to go to a "private college" they better have either 1: a good reason or 2: a full scholarship. And since the only good reason would be a full scholarship, that narrows down the possibilities.

We are setting aside some money for college for our three (not that much, it might cover the books!). Both sets of grandparents are also putting into college funds for them. When the time comes they will be aware of how much is available for them to have towards college. They are going to have to take on the remainder.

We even have some underhanded ideas planned out: Pam and I are graduates of 2 really good state colleges in Virginia (UVA, W&M). Virginia also has Va Tech, plus a bunch of pretty good "2-tier" colleges. But we live in Connecticut, where there is not a selection for high-end state universities (UConn is it, and UVA it is not) . But, one set of grandparents lives in Virginia. SO: summer before college, kid goes to live with grandparents, gets a job there, gets a driver's license, maintains local address for a year etc... Next year: IN STATE BABY!

 

[Evo]

Or just make sure that they marry someone that will pay off their Ivy League student loans.

I paid my ex-husband's loans off (Yale & Dartmouth).

 

[Laura1013]

Goodness! Why not allow your kids to finance college themselves (or partially themselves)? My private undergrad education cost somewhere around $100K total, and I do not regret it. I got a 1/3 scholarship, my parents paid for my first year, and I was on my own after that.

I'd be royally upset if my parents had given me an ultimatum: full scholarship or cheap in-state public school. It's MY education. Let your kids decide what they want and what's best for them in the long run. It may be that cheaper school with no-to-little student loan debt is the best for them, but they may have other ideas. Let them learn to become adults.

 

[Moonbear]

I'm just going to make sure I have a job at a university that provides free or extremely reduced tuition to children of faculty if/when it comes time to have kids and get them through college...and if they want to attend school somewhere else, they'll have to cough up the difference on their own.

 

[Cyrus]

Goodness! Why not allow your kids to finance college themselves (or partially themselves)? My private undergrad education cost somewhere around $100K total, and I do not regret it. I got a 1/3 scholarship, my parents paid for my first year, and I was on my own after that.

I'd be royally upset if my parents had given me an ultimatum: full scholarship or cheap in-state public school. It's MY education. Let your kids decide what they want and what's best for them in the long run. It may be that cheaper school with no-to-little student loan debt is the best for them, but they may have other ideas. Let them learn to become adults.

Yeah, just 'let them learn to become adults' by having over 100k in debt. Smart idea. 100k is not something a kid straight out of high school will have any idea on how long it will take to pay off. That, on top of the fact that they will need a car and a house once the graduate, will screw them into a lifetime of debt.

 

[Laura1013]

Yeah, just 'let them learn to become adults' by having over 100k in debt. Smart idea. 100k is not something a kid straight out of high school will have any idea on how long it will take to pay off. That, on top of the fact that they will need a car and a house once the graduate, will screw them into a lifetime of debt.

I knew what I was getting into when I was 19 and signed my first student loan (not all the details, but the general gist). I have tens of thousands of dollars in debt. I plan to pay it off within 6-ish years of graduating with my B.S. Certainly not a lifetime of debt (unless I die tomorrow)!

My point is, 18-years-old is the legal age (in the U.S.), and is a time when people need to start learning how to make financial and education decisions for themselves.

 

[Cyrus]

You don't 'learn' to make financial decisions starting out with a 100k loan.

You can learn to pay off your car maybe. But not something the price of a house. Thats called learning the hard way.

I cringe when your debt is more than my entire cost of college. You got to be out of your mind to pay more than 100k in tuition if you have a perfectly good in state school you can attend.

After a few years of work experience, no ones even going to care where you got your degree from.

 

[Evo]

Goodness! Why not allow your kids to finance college themselves (or partially themselves)? My private undergrad education cost somewhere around $100K total, and I do not regret it. I got a 1/3 scholarship, my parents paid for my first year, and I was on my own after that.

I'd be royally upset if my parents had given me an ultimatum: full scholarship or cheap in-state public school. It's MY education. Let your kids decide what they want and what's best for them in the long run. It may be that cheaper school with no-to-little student loan debt is the best for them, but they may have other ideas. Let them learn to become adults.

I think that is excellent Laura. My kids totally get what tuition costs are, etc... My ex-husband and I are currently paying their tuition and they are paying all other expenses, but they have to keep up a high GPA. Luckily, they aren't slackers.

 

[Laura1013]

You don't 'learn' to make financial decisions starting out with a 100k loan.

You can learn to pay off your car maybe. But not something the price of a house. Thats called learning the hard way.

I cringe when your debt is more than my entire cost of college. You got to be out of your mind to pay more than 100k in tuition if you have a perfectly good in state school you can attend.

After a few years of work experience, no ones even going to care where you got your degree from.

You did things your way, and it worked for you. I did things my way, and it worked for me. Let each person choose what's the right way for him/herself. Researching college costs and financial aid information and thinking long-term is an excellent way to learn how to make financial decisions. If an 18-year-old can't do that, he/she may not be ready for college.

Just to clarify, my undergrad college tuition totaled a bit over $100K, but that's not how much I owe. Like I said, I did have a scholarship, and my parents helped.

 

[Cyrus]

I hope the name of your school startd with Har, and ended with vard.

I don't think understanding debt translates to being able to go to college. Most kids straight out of high school probably don't have one clue about the loan system. Whats a good loan for them, how long will they need to pay it off, what's a good rate? Thats a lot to learn very quickly for a very, very, serious loan they are about to take.

 

[Evo]

I hope the name of your school startd with Har, and ended with vard.

I don't think understanding debt translates to being able to go to college. Most kids straight out of high school probably don't have one clue about the loan system. Whats a good loan for them, how long will they need to pay it off, what's a good rate? Thats a lot to learn very quickly for a very, very, serious loan they are about to take.

My youngest daughter was thinking of taking out a loan to get some extra cash, but when she worked out the numbers, she realized that she'd have to pay the entire loan back in 4 months not to get killed on interest.

 

[Cyrus]

Well, I would have been clueless, and intimidated.

Ive never taken out a 100k loan before. Thats the kind of thing if you do it wrong, you're goign to pay for a long, long time.

 

[tgt]

i got a better question: what's the point of commitment

Because you love them. It's something 'real', unlike marriage.

 

[Chi Meson]

Goodness! Why not allow your kids to finance college themselves (or partially themselves)?

Well that's actually the plan. I was being a little tongue-in-cheek back there. The point is, we'll let them know how much we will be able to support them well before they make a decision on where to go. If they do have a really good reason to go to a particular private college, then they need to understand that they will be taking on a big financial burden that we will not be able to help them with.

 

[Laura1013]

Because you love them. It's something 'real', unlike marriage.

How is marriage unreal? Have you met any married couples...?

 

[Astronuc]

Because you love them. It's something 'real', unlike marriage.

Well, it seems that folks in this thread are referring to more than one definition of 'marriage'. On the one hand, it is a legal contractual insititution, and on the other hand, it is a binding relationship between two people, traditionally a man and woman. In my posts, I am referring to the latter, which is quite real.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

I hope the name of your school startd with Har, and ended with vard.

I have an honorary associate's degree from the Harvard School of Cosmetology, Boston, Georgia.