What are the solutions to the complex polynomial equation ##z^3+3i\bar z=0##?

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The discussion revolves around finding solutions to the complex polynomial equation z^3 + 3i conjugate(z) = 0. Participants explore various methods, including substituting z with its polar form and analyzing the magnitudes and angles of both sides of the equation. They derive that the magnitude of z must equal √3 and discuss the implications of the phase angles, leading to multiple potential solutions. The conversation highlights the complexity introduced by the conjugate term, which complicates the degree of the polynomial. Ultimately, the solutions include z = 0 and other values expressed in trigonometric form.
  • #31
Dank2 said:
3√3((cos(11/8pi)+isin(11/8pi))
z=√3(cos(x)+isin(x)), why did you write 3√3?
And there are more solutions. What do you get for k=1 and k=3?
 
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  • #32
ehild said:
z=√3(cos(x)+isin(x)), why did you write 3√3?
And there are more solutions. What do you get for k=2?
i meant superscript(3)
4x = 3pi/2 + 0 pi = > x =3/8 pi
4x = 3pi/2 + 2pi = x = 7/8 pi
4 x = 3pi/2 +4pi = > x = 11/8 pi = 3/8pi
 
  • #33
Dank2 said:
i meant superscript(3)
4x = 3pi/2 + 0 pi = > x =3/8 pi
4x = 3pi/2 + 2pi = x = 7/8 pi
4 x = 3pi/2 +4pi = > x = 11/8 pi = 3/8pi
0(cos0+isin0)
4√3(cos3/8pi + isin 3/8pi)
4√3(cos7/8pi + isin 7/8pi)
 
  • #34
Dank2 said:
i meant superscript(3)
4x = 3pi/2 + 0 pi = > x =3/8 pi
4x = 3pi/2 + 2pi = x = 7/8 pi
4 x = 3pi/2 +4pi = > x = 11/8 pi = 3/8pi
11/8 pi is not the same as 3/8 pi . The period is 2pi, not pi. So x= 3/8 pi + pi is different, and you have one more angle, less than 2pi.
And do not forget that r=√3. Do not change it to everything else.
 
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  • #35
Dank2 said:
0(cos0+isin0)
4[/SUP]√3(cos3/8pi + isin 3/8pi)
4√3(cos7/8pi + isin 7/8pi)
:nb)
 
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  • #36
ehild said:
:nb)
hehe, that's because r = sqrt (3)

i'm confused now, how many roots does a complex polynomial have, i thought it was 3, as the highest exponent of that polynomial
 
  • #37
Dank2 said:
hehe, that's because r = sqrt (3)

i'm confused now, how many roots does a complex polynomial have, i thought it was 3, as the highest exponent of that polynomial
or is it a complex polynomial
 
  • #38
Dank2 said:
hehe, that's because r = sqrt (3)

i'm confused now, how many roots does a complex polynomial have, i thought it was 3, as the highest exponent of that polynomial
It is not a polynomial of z if it includes the complex conjugate.
 
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  • #39
Dank2 said:
hehe, that's because r = sqrt (3)
You mean a square, with 4 sides ? :wink:
 
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  • #40
Remember your first attempt with that two third-order equations for a and b. If you eliminate one of them you get a polynomial of degree higher than 3.
 
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  • #41
ehild said:
You mean a square, with 4 sides ? :wink:
i remember t
ehild said:
Remember your first attempt with that two third-order equations for a and b. If you eliminate one of them you get a polynomial of degree higher than 3.
0(cos0+isin0)
√3(cos3/8pi + isin 3/8pi)
√3(cos7/8pi + isin 7/8pi)
√3(cos15/8pi+isin15/8pi)

4x = 3pi + 8pi ==> 19/8 pi ==> 2pi + 3/8pi = 3/8pi
 
  • #42
Dank2 said:
i remember t

0(cos0+isin0)
√3(cos3/8pi + isin 3/8pi)
√3(cos7/8pi + isin 7/8pi)
√3(cos15/8pi+isin15/8pi)

4x = 3pi + 8pi ==> 19/8 pi ==> 2pi + 3/8pi = 3/8pi
is there any thumb rule as to how much many roots should i expect? like is it the number of roots of z + number of roots of * ?
 
  • #43
Dank2 said:
is there any thumb rule as to how much many roots should i expect? like is it the number of roots of z + number of roots of * ?
I do not know any thumb rules. You need all angles possible between zero and 2pi. Remember, the 3rd power brought in 3x and the conjugate on the other side brought in -x. So there were 4x=something+2pik. That is four roots, except for the trivial one (z=0).
 
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  • #44
ehild said:
I do not know any thumb rules. You need all angles possible between zero and 2pi. Remember, the 3rd power brought in 3x and the conjugate on the other side brought in -x. So there were 4x=something+2pik. That is four roots, except for the trivial one (z=0).
that got me a bit of confused, since I've seen z^3.

thanks for the help ;)
 
  • #45
Dank2 said:
that got me a bit of confused, since I've seen z^3.

thanks for the help ;)
But there was also z*, and it is not power of z.
 
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  • #46
ehild said:
But there was also z*, and it is not power of z.
yep, that also, and other algebra mistakes, i think i will use this forum from time to time ;)
 
  • #47
I am looking forward to see you soon again
 
  • #48
Dank2 said:
so i opened it and came out something hairy with a^3 - b^3i -3ab(b-ai) +3(b+ai) = 0
(a^3)-3(b^2)a+3b+(3(a^2)b-b^3+3a)i ==>
(a^3)-3(b^2)a+3b = 0
3(a^2)b-b^3+3a = 0

What can i try to do here?

btw the solutions can be shown as trigonometric (cosx+isinx) aswell.
I see that my friend, ehild, has guided you to the solution.

I considered solving this an alternate way, by using your results in the attached quote.
Multiply by ##\ (a)\ ##: ##\quad \ (a^3)-3(b^2)a+3b = 0\ ##
Multiply by ##\ {(-b)}\ ##: ##\ \ 3(a^2)b-(
b^3)+3a = 0\ ##​
Add the equations.

You get
##a^4-6a^2 b^2+b^4 = 0\ ##​

Adding ##\ 4a^2b^2\ ## or ##\ 8a^2b^2\ ## will give easily solved results.

I haven't tried anything beyond this.
 
  • #49
SammyS said:
I see that my friend, ehild, has guided you to the solution.

I considered solving this an alternate way, by using your results in the attached quote.
Multiply by ##\ (a)\ ##: ##\quad \ (a^3)-3(b^2)a+3b = 0\ ##
Multiply by ##\ {(-b)}\ ##: ##\ \ 3(a^2)b-(
b^3)+3a = 0\ ##​
Add the equations.

You get
##a^4-6a^2 b^2+b^4 = 0\ ##​

Adding ##\ 4a^2b^2\ ## or ##\ 8a^2b^2\ ## will give easily solved results.

I haven't tried anything beyond this.

I've added 4a^2b^2, came up with a^2-2ab-b^2 = 0
How can i find the roots from here? i can see how i can get a=0 and b = 0, which is the first soltution, what about the rest?
 
  • #50
Dank2 said:
I've added 4a^2b^2, came up with a^2-2ab-b^2 = 0
How can i find the roots from here? i can see how i can get a=0 and b = 0, which is the first soltution, what about the rest?
How did you come up with that equation?

What is 0 + 4a2b2 ?

That's what you should have on the right hand side. The left hand side should be a4-2a2b2-b4. Right?
 
  • #51
SammyS said:
How did you come up with that equation?

What is 0 + 4a2b2 ?

That's what you should have on the right hand side. The left hand side should be a4-2a2b2-b4. Right?
a^4-2a^2b^2+b^4 =4a^2b^2 ==> (a^2-b^2)^2 = 4a^2b^2
taking root of both sides ==> a^2-b^2 = 2ab
 
  • #52
Dank2 said:
a^4-2a^2b^2+b^4 =4a^2b^2 ==> (a^2-b^2)^2 = 4a^2b^2
taking root of both sides ==> a^2-b^2 = 2ab
Oh! OK. That is correct.

Now solve for a in terms of b.
 
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  • #53
SammyS said:
Oh! OK. That is correct.

Now solve for a in terms of b.
How do i do that. a(a-2b) = b^2 ==> a = b^2 over (a-2b)
 
  • #54
Dank2 said:
How do i do that. a(a-2b) = b^2 ==> a = b^2 over (a-2b)
It's a quadratic equation.

Complete the square or use the quadratic formula.

To complete the square, add 2b2 to ##\ a^2-2ab -b^2 = 0 \ . ##

Added in Edit:
Also notice that the equation should be
##\ a^2\pm 2ab -b^2 = 0 \ . ##​
 
  • #55
SammyS said:
It's a quadratic equation.

Complete the square or use the quadratic formula.

To complete the square, add 2b2 to ##\ a^2-2ab -b^2 = 0 \ . ##

Added in Edit:
Also notice that the equation should be
##\ a^2\pm 2ab -b^2 = 0 \ . ##​
So, a^2-2ab+b^2 = 2b^2, should i solve only left hand side?
 
  • #56
SammyS said:
It's a quadratic equation.

Complete the square or use the quadratic formula.

To complete the square, add 2b2 to ##\ a^2-2ab -b^2 = 0 \ . ##
No. (How is it even possible to solve only one side of an equation?)

Take the square root of bot sides.

Don't forget the ' ± ' .

 
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  • #57
SammyS said:
No. (How is it even possible to solve only one side of an equation?)

Take the square root of bot sides.

Don't forget the ' ± ' .

why +-
 
Last edited:
  • #58
Dank2 said:
why +-
Really?

You got it from taking the square root of both sides of some equation. Does that ring a bell?
 
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  • #59
i have got 6 solutions for z , what's the answer?
 
  • #60
Sahil Kukreja said:
i have got 6 solutions for z , what's the answer?
See message #41 4 solutions.
 

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