What does the probabilistic interpretation of QM claim?

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    Interpretation Qm
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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the probabilistic interpretation of quantum mechanics (QM), particularly regarding the measurement of observables and the implications of quantum uncertainty. Participants explore the nature of probability densities associated with wave functions, the role of operators, and the relationship between theoretical constructs and experimental practices.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the probability interpretation of QM specifies that the probability of observing a particular eigenvalue is given by the expression psi^* P_k psi, where P_k is the projector onto the k-th eigenspace, but does not define which operators are observable.
  • Others argue that the assumption that |psi(x_1,...,x_n|^2 represents the probability density for simultaneous particle positions is often idealized and not used in practical measurements.
  • There is a claim that Wigner's theorem indicates that only quantities commuting with all additive conserved quantities can be precisely measured, suggesting limitations on the observability of certain operators.
  • Some participants note that particle detectors primarily measure momentum rather than position, leading to a discussion about the interpretation of scattering experiments in the momentum picture.
  • One participant points to the double-slit experiment as an example where the wave-mechanics interpretation is employed, while another challenges the applicability of this interpretation in real experimental contexts.
  • There is a discussion about the role of ionization in particle detection, with one participant suggesting that the interaction causes a collapse of the wavefunction, complicating the correlation between the initial state and the measurement outcome.
  • Some participants express agreement that |\psi(p)|^2 can be interpreted as the probability density for finding a particle with momentum p, while others emphasize the importance of distinguishing between different representations of the wave function.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

The discussion reveals multiple competing views regarding the interpretation of probability in quantum mechanics, the nature of observables, and the implications of experimental techniques. There is no consensus on the validity of certain interpretations or the implications of quantum uncertainty.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in the assumptions made about observables and measurements, particularly regarding the idealized nature of certain interpretations and the practical challenges of measuring position versus momentum in experiments.

  • #91
strangerep said:
It's not all-or-nothing.
Maths develops/evolves partly to meet new challenges.



Perhaps, but they should probably be taken up in the philosophy forum,
since this seems to be gradually drifting away from the original intent of
this thread.

This is all pure philosophy anyway unless you are going to tell me interpretations now aren't? But yes I was not expecting a discussion on them anyway. They just highlight that mathematically we have no idea if maths even represents anything, just that it appears to inductively reproduce results. The actual maths is pretty much a philosophical representation of something we can't measure, on which we base a philosophical interpretation.
 
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  • #92
A. Neumaier said:
In my lecture http://arnold-neumaier.at/ms/optslides.pdf , I call this revision the thermal interpretation of quantum mechanics. It does not require the slightest alteration of quantum mechanics or quantum field theory. I only changed the currently accepted weird way of talking about quantum system (a long tradition introduced by many years of brainwashing) into one which matches common sense much better. So it is not a change in the foundations but only a change in the interpretation - one that is more consistent with the mathematics

A discussion forum for discussing the thermal interpretation has been approved:
https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=490492
Please post your comments there.
 
  • #93
Calrid said:
Bit of a tangent but I read an article about them having closed all the loop holes in Bell's recently.

Calrid said:
There are only one or two left now that haven't been filled in by experiment and I suspect they will become ever more absurd as they are closed, or more bizarrely correct even! :biggrin:

Ah? Not all have been closed, clearly, since you're saying there are a few left lingering.
 

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