What is the difference between conservative and nonconservative force?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the differences between conservative and non-conservative forces, exploring their definitions, characteristics, and examples. Participants examine the implications of directionality and potential functions associated with these forces.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant claims that non-conservative forces, such as friction, have no direction, while conservative forces, like gravitational force, do.
  • Another participant challenges this claim, stating that all forces have direction and clarifying that conservative forces are defined by the existence of an associated potential function.
  • A participant later refines their argument, suggesting that frictional force has a changing direction, which complicates its classification as a potential function.
  • It is proposed that the work done by non-conservative forces depends on the path taken, contrasting with conservative forces where the work is path-independent.
  • Another participant provides an additional example of a conservative force, specifically the electrostatic force.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the directionality of non-conservative forces and the criteria for defining conservative forces. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of direction on the classification of forces.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions regarding the definitions of conservative and non-conservative forces are not explicitly stated, and the discussion does not resolve the nuances of how directionality affects these classifications.

Outrageous
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Conservative force like gravitational force has direction.
Non conservative force like frictional force has no direction.
so non conservative force doesn't take degree of freedom into the consideration.
Is that the meaning? please help.
Thank you
 
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What makes you say a non-conservative force has no direction? All forces have direction. A conservative force is one for which there exists an associated potential function.
 
WannabeNewton said:
What makes you say a non-conservative force has no direction? All forces have direction. A conservative force is one for which there exists an associated potential function.

sorry , actually I want to say frictional force is the force that its direction can be changing all the time.
For gravity , i know we have gravitational potential energy ,this is because we define some place be zero potential and then compare potential energy of a object relative to that zero potential.
We can't do the same to the frictional force because the frictional force do not have fixed direction? how to say frictional force is not potential function?
 
No it has nothing to do with direction. The direction of gravity can easily change: for example a radial gravitational field has a different direction as you turn around. The point is that for conservative forces, the work done in moving from one point to another is independent of the path taken so we can construct a well-defined potential function. For friction on the other hand, the work done depends on the path so we cannot create a meaningful potential function for friction.
 
So besides look at it as a potential function , can I say that every time if the work done depends on the path then there is a non conservative force act ?
Can you please give me another example of conservative force , please.
 
Yes you can. Another example of a conservative force is the electrostatic force.
 
Thank you so much
 

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