What is the effect of centripetal force on velocity?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the effects of centripetal force on the velocity of a car navigating a curve while maintaining a constant force. Participants explore the relationship between velocity, speed, and the forces acting on the car during this maneuver, addressing both conceptual and technical aspects.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the velocity of a car changes when it goes around a curve due to the change in direction, even if the speed remains constant.
  • Others question the nature of the forces involved, particularly the sideways force that allows the car to navigate the curve, seeking clarification on its source.
  • There is a discussion about the distinction between speed and velocity, with some participants emphasizing that velocity includes direction, while speed does not.
  • One participant proposes that in an ideal scenario, a car could maintain constant speed without applying force, raising questions about real-world factors like friction and air resistance.
  • Some participants challenge the idea that lateral forces have no effect on the vehicle if the steering wheel is not turned, suggesting that lateral forces would still influence the car's trajectory.
  • There is a mention of vector addition in the context of forces and velocities, with a participant attempting to clarify how lateral forces interact with forward motion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the effects of lateral forces and the relationship between speed and velocity. There is no consensus on how these forces interact or the implications for a car's motion when navigating curves.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the complexity of the forces acting on a car, including friction and air resistance, and the nuances in understanding how these forces affect motion. The discussion includes unresolved questions about the direct relationships between force, speed, and direction.

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  • #62
sophiecentaur said:
I don't think that's right because the direction in which the 'footprint' points is not in the plane of the wheel. The process of compressing the front of the footprint and releasing it at the back involves hysteresis and the forces (torques) do not cancel. This will produce a torque which 'fights' against the applied torque on the steering wheel.
Be careful. The steering wheel does not apply any propulsive torque, that's the engine's job. The torque that the steering wheel fights is due to the rearward offset of the contact patch from the steering axis, i.e. caster.
 
  • #63
rcgldr said:
This would be complicated. It's a combination of factors, cornering load, deformation of the tires due to a lateral load, and the hysteresis factor of the tire compound.

Can we simplify things by considering free floating bodies orbiting a central point? E.g. the planets, but with equal sized objects.

Would those nearer the centre (on a path of higher curvature) move at a slower speed?
 
  • #64
rcgldr said:
This would be complicated. It's a combination of factors, cornering load, deformation of the tires due to a lateral load, and the hysteresis factor of the tire compound.

Rupert Young said:
Can we simplify things by considering free floating bodies orbiting a central point? E.g. the planets, but with equal sized objects. Would those nearer the centre (on a path of higher curvature) move at a slower speed?

The loss in speed is due to tires consuming energy (conversion into heat). The amount of energy consumed by tires is increased when cornering. In a scenario where there are no energy losses, then cornering would not reduce speed (this is a self fulfilling statement, no energy lost means that kinetic energy and the related speed don't change).
 
  • #65

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