Why amplitude doesn't affect speed of sound?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the relationship between amplitude and the speed of sound in a medium. Participants explore theoretical concepts, challenge assumptions, and examine the implications of sound wave properties, including energy transfer and molecular motion.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that increasing amplitude, which is associated with higher energy in sound waves, should lead to faster particle interactions and thus an increase in the speed of sound.
  • Others argue that the energy of sound waves attenuates with distance due to absorption by the medium, which may counteract any potential increase in speed.
  • It is noted that sound is a pressure wave and that the amplitude of sound pressure is much less than ambient atmospheric pressure, with significant changes occurring only in shock waves.
  • A participant references a source indicating that the speed of sound is slightly sensitive to sound amplitude, suggesting a potential but minor effect.
  • One participant clarifies that while individual air particles may move faster with increased amplitude, the overall speed of the sound wave remains constant.
  • Another participant discusses the dominance of temperature in determining the speed of sound, suggesting that significant energy input is required to affect temperature and, consequently, speed.
  • There is a question raised about whether any temperature increase can be detected near high-power sound sources, indicating a curiosity about practical implications.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the relationship between amplitude and speed of sound, with no consensus reached on the mechanisms involved or the effects of amplitude on sound speed.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge that the speed of sound is influenced by factors such as temperature and molecular interactions, but the discussion remains open regarding the specific effects of amplitude and energy transfer.

hasankamal007
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If amplitude is the measure of energy in a sound wave -
On increasing amplitude, the medium particles should hit each other in lesser time because they have more force(which increases their speed) and this cycle should repeat and repeat. Eventually, the speed of sound should increase. But that's not what happens.
So what's wrong in this cycle?
 
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ahhhh but the the energy of the sound wave attenuates with distance through a medium
because energy is absorbed by the medium
 
Sound is a pressure wave. The amplitude of sound pressure is much less than ambient athmospheric pressure (see the table). When they become comparable it's called shock wave.
 
hasankamal007 said:
If amplitude is the measure of energy in a sound wave -
On increasing amplitude, the medium particles should hit each other in lesser time because they have more force(which increases their speed) and this cycle should repeat and repeat. Eventually, the speed of sound should increase. But that's not what happens.
So what's wrong in this cycle?


individual particles of air are being accelerated fater and are moving faster but the speed of the wave itself is the same
 
grandpa
Can you elaborate please. Thanks.
 
The range of speeds (Kinetic Energy) of air molecules is immense. The speed of sound in a gas is dominated by the average time taken for each molecule to travel across the space between, to the next molecule. (simple model for the purpose of making the point). So the speed depends, essentially, on the gas temperature. Any effect in which the 'forward travelling' molecules from the source (pushed forward by the loudspeaker cone) would, somehow, push the downstream molecules away faster would be counterbalanced by the fact that there would be an equal and opposite effect in the other direction on the other half of the sound cycle. The mean addition to velocity would be zero.- certainly in the 'far field' situation.

The only thing that would increase this speed would be the injection of a lot of energy (in total) to increase the temperature. A 'normal' level of sound, from a loudspeaker or even a Jet engine (not the exhaust gases, of course) would not constitute a significant amount of energy and doesn't affect the temperature so I can't see how the speed of sound would be level dependent. Has anyone ever detected an increase in temperature right in front of a high-power loudspeaker, that could be attributed to the flux of sound energy? It would be interesting to know.
 

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