gary350
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Why does 32 F ice have more energy that 32 F water?
The discussion clarifies that 32°F ice has less energy than 32°F water due to the concept of latent heat. When water freezes, it requires energy extraction, which does not remain in the ice but is expelled as heat. This means that while ice can cool substances effectively, it does not possess more energy than liquid water at the same temperature. The conversation also highlights practical applications, such as using ice bottles to cool wine during fermentation.
PREREQUISITESThis discussion is beneficial for students of physics, home winemakers, and anyone interested in thermodynamics and heat transfer principles.
As you can tell by the reply by V50, you really should try to make a better opening post. Where have you read this? Post links please whenever asking technical questions. And if you post those links, will the answer be self-evident?gary350 said:Why does 32 F ice have more energy that 32 F water?
Wrong way around. The water has more energy. You have to add energy to melt the ice.gary350 said:Why does 32 F ice have more energy that 32 F water?
Yes, it is because the freezer is extracting heat (energy) from the water / ice. The water takes a long time to freeze, because there is a lot of heat to extract while it freezes (called latent heat). So the ice has less energy than liquid water.gary350 said:I am making blackberry wine fermentation generates heat. I have water frozen in 2 liter soft drink bottles. When wine gets up to 72 deg F it is too hot it needs to be 68 deg all the time but best I can do is put bottles of ice in the wine to cool it down. A bottle of ice will cool the wine down to about 61 degrees. I had 5 bottles of ice frozen over a period of 8 days all the ice was used up in 6 days and the freezer is not able to freeze ice bottles fast enough so I have been using bottles that are only 5% or 10% frozen to cool wine. A bottle that is not completely frozen only cools wine down to about 68 deg F. It takes about 4 hours for a solid piece of ice to completely melt lowering wine temperature about 6 deg colder than 32 deg water bottles.
Michael Price said:Yes, it is because the freezer is extracting heat (energy) from the water / ice. The water takes a long time to freeze, because there is a lot of heat to extract while it freezes (called latent heat). So the ice has less energy than liquid water.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latent_heat
Yes, you remember correctly. But the energy required to freeze the water does not end up in the ice. The work (a form of energy) required to extract the energy from the water gets chucked out the back of the freezer as heat.gary350 said:You must be thinking heat is energy and cold is absence of energy.
I am thinking ice has the ability to remove more heat than 32 deg water.
I remember college physics teacher explaining, it takes more energy to make ice than cold water the same temperature. That was 50 years ago. I don't remember WHY it takes more energy to make ice?