Why Does a2 Equal m1g/m2 in an Accelerating Pulley System?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the dynamics of an accelerating pulley system, specifically addressing the relationship between the accelerations of two masses, m1 and m2, and the forces acting on them. Participants are exploring the reasoning behind the equation a2 = m1g/m2 and questioning the assumptions leading to variations in acceleration calculations.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the relationship between the forces acting on m1 and m2, questioning the validity of treating them as a single system. They explore the implications of different forces and how they affect the acceleration of the system.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants raising questions about the forces involved and their impact on the system's acceleration. Some guidance has been offered regarding the need to reconsider the system being analyzed, but no consensus has been reached on the correct approach or interpretation.

Contextual Notes

Participants are grappling with the implications of their assumptions about the forces acting on the system, particularly in relation to the applied force on M and the forces from the wall and pulley. There is a recognition that these factors may need to be accounted for in their analysis.

CausticPhantom
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a1 = a2
a1 = F/(M+m1+m2) | Force/(Mass of entire system) = acceleration of entire system
*a2 = (m1g)/(m2+m1) | Force = m1g; acceleration of m2 and m1 = m1g/(m1+m2)

My answer: F = (m1g)(M+m1+m2)/(m2+m1)
The book's answer: F = (m1g)(M+m1+m2)/(m2)
*This step is what leads me to a slight variation of the book's provided answer.

I've looked through the forums, and have done a lot of thinking myself, and I believe what it comes down to is a false assumption. I understand that the force pulling m1 and m2 is m1g, and that the tension that then pulls m2 is equal to m1g, leading to an acceleration of m1g/m2 and subsequently the correct answer, but I do not understand what is incorrect about concluding that the system (looking at m2 and m1) as a whole accelerates at m1g/(m1+m2). Gut feeling tells me that the conclusion I've made is incorrect because the acceleration would be m1g/(m1+m2) in an inertial frame, but not in this case because it is part of an accelerating system.

Why does a2 = m1g/m2 rather than a2 = m1g/(m1+m2)?
 

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CausticPhantom said:
but I do not understand what is incorrect about concluding that the system (looking at m2 and m1) as a whole accelerates at m1g/(m1+m2).
You have here considered m1 and m2 as a system, but the force you quote is not the force on that system, it is the force on m2 only.
 
Orodruin said:
You have here considered m1 and m2 as a system, but the force you quote is not the force on that system, it is the force on m2 only.

Is there another force that I would need to account for, such as the applied force on M?
 
CausticPhantom said:
Is there another force that I would need to account for, such as the applied force on M?
There are forces acting from the wall on m1 and from the pulley on the rope. Computing these forces is not necessary if you chose a better system to consider.
 

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