Why is an integrated function with multiple terms....

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the integral of the function "∫ 1/(ax+b) dx" and seeks a proof and explanation for the formula "1/a * ln|ax+b| + C". Participants explore various methods of integration, including substitution and induction, while expressing varying levels of understanding and familiarity with calculus concepts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Homework-related
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest using substitution with "u=ax+b" to simplify the integral.
  • Others propose considering the problem from an induction perspective to understand the formula's validity.
  • A participant expresses confusion about the substitution method and its connection to the integral, requesting further clarification.
  • Another participant emphasizes the importance of understanding the chain rule and the properties of the natural logarithm in proving the integral.
  • Some participants discuss the nature of the constant "C" in the integral, noting that it can represent a family of functions rather than a single constant.
  • There are repeated requests for a clear proof and explanation of the integral, indicating varying levels of calculus knowledge among participants.
  • One participant points out the need for proper notation when writing mathematical expressions to avoid confusion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the need for a proof and explanation of the integral, but there are multiple competing views on the best approach to understand and solve it. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the clarity of the proof and the methods to be used.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about the assumptions that can be made in proving the integral, such as the acceptance of the chain rule and the properties of logarithmic functions. There is also a lack of consensus on the appropriate level of detail needed for explanations.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students learning integration techniques, particularly those interested in understanding substitution methods and the properties of logarithmic integrals.

5P@N
Messages
58
Reaction score
3
I have encountered this general Integral:

"∫ 1/ax+b dx = 1/a * ln|ax+b| +C"

I was not given a proof, but would like one, along with an easy explanation, please.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Try recasting the integral with u=ax+b and see what you get.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Thewindyfan
Try to look at this from an induction kind of standpoint to see why it works.

Otherwise, you're going to have to do this purely through symbols. Remember what terms are constant and what terms are changing.
 
I'm afraid I don't understand what the "u" is in your equation, jedishrfu.

And I don't understand what the connection is between induction and this formula, Thewindyfan.

Understand that I don't presume you all are communicating worthless or nonsensical information. I suspect that there is some important and relevant information contained in your statements...but precisely what it is, and how it relates to the above equation, escapes my comprehension. Would you all please explain?
 
5P@N said:
I have encountered this general Integral:

"∫ 1/ax+b dx = 1/a * ln|ax+b| +C"

I was not given a proof, but would like one, along with an easy explanation, please.
Maybe we can try it with two questions:
1) What do you get when you compute the following integral?
$$\int \frac{1}{x} \, dx$$
2) Do you know how to use substitutions when computing integrals?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Thewindyfan
The main difficulties here might arose from the question what you regard to be a proof, i.e. what can be assumed as given. Basically the chain rule of differentiation and the fact that the natural logarithm is the anti-derivative of the function ##x → 1/x## are needed here. May we assume either of them or both or neither? Do you know what ## +C## stands for? The ##u## in question is the substitution ##u(x) := a*x + b## with ##du / dx = u'(x) = a## which leads to ##dx = du / a## and so on.
 
Samy_A: I think that the answer to your first question is ln|x|. Am I correct in understanding however that 1/a is the coefficient of the x variable, which is during integration of x set aside and then later multiplied with the resulting integrated x, and that there is no division of the raised power of the x variable, because of the peculiar characteristics of the natural log?
I confess that I don't know how to use substitutions when computing integrals...would you explain what this is in the above example?
 
5P@N said:
Samy_A: I think that the answer to your first question is ln|x|. Am I correct in understanding however that 1/a is the coefficient of the x variable, which is during integration of x set aside and then later multiplied with the resulting integrated x, and that there is no division of the raised power of the x variable, because of the peculiar characteristics of the natural log?
I confess that I don't know how to use substitutions when computing integrals...would you explain what this is in the above example?

Well, I'm sorry to say this, but you will probably need to go through a calculus book and learn about substitution and integration by parts from it. No forum post can substitute that.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Thewindyfan
That's okay, micromass. I've got sufficient character and determination to do the necessary work. There's no other way than through hard work, I got that. If you wanted to point me to a good online resource teaching this thing though, it would be much appreciated.
 
  • #10
5P@N said:
Samy_A: I think that the answer to your first question is ln|x|. Am I correct in understanding however that 1/a is the coefficient of the x variable, which is during integration of x set aside and then later multiplied with the resulting integrated x, and that there is no division of the raised power of the x variable, because of the peculiar characteristics of the natural log?
I confess that I don't know how to use substitutions when computing integrals...would you explain what this is in the above example?
More precisely,
$$\int \frac{1}{x} \, dx \, = \ln|x| + C$$
, where ##C## is a constant (EDIT: the constant can be different for positive and negative values of x, thanks micromass).

The integral in your question,
$$\int \frac{1}{ax+b} \, dx \, =\frac{1}{a} \ln|ax+b| + C$$
, is computed from the first one using a simple substitution.

But I agree with @micromass , basic (and important) subjects as integration methods are better learned in a book. You can use a forum such as this one if you have specific questions: members will gladly help you.
 
Last edited:
  • #11
Samy_A said:
More precisely,
$$\int \frac{1}{x} \, dx \, = \ln|x| + C$$,
where ##C## is a constant.

Or more precisely: where ##C## is a locally constant function. There are more functions that differentiate to ##1/x## than just ##\ln|x|+ C## if you merely take ##C## to be a constant. Sorry for being annoying :D

Anyway to the OP: what math are you comfortable with? Especially, what calculus do you know, and where did you learn it from?
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Thewindyfan
  • #12
5P@N said:
I'm afraid I don't understand what the "u" is in your equation, jedishrfu.

And I don't understand what the connection is between induction and this formula,
u is the common variable used in the substitution method of solving complex integrals, at least in the U.S.

I mentioned induction in hopes that you would know what that meant, but I'm afraid you didn't understand where I was getting at. Samy_A basically summed up what I wanted to get you at: think about one simple case where you get a similar family of functions from this integral. Look at how you did that integral, and then apply it to this one here to solve it.

My mistake for not realizing you wanted a concise proof of this solution, however. In the original post the answer seems to be miswritten with an additional "x" before you made the edit.

edit:
This isn't necessarily true for ALL integration problems where a substitution is efficient enough to solve the problem, but here's my view on the real basics on it. I will edit this post later with an example problem to show you this basics of u-substitution, or at least the main purpose it provides to attacking complex looking integrals.
 
  • #13
Thanks windyfan, but there's no need. It so happened that as soon as I went back to my online lessons - voila - there was u-substitution and integration by parts. Soon I'll be able to understand you all.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Thewindyfan
  • #14
5P@N said:
I have encountered this general Integral:

"∫ 1/ax+b dx = 1/a * ln|ax+b| +C"

I was not given a proof, but would like one, along with an easy explanation, please.
Please learn to write fractions correctly. 1/ax + b means ##\frac 1 a x + b##, which I'm sure isn't what you intended. When you write fractions with everything in one line of text, use parentheses, especially around a numerator or denominator with multiple terms.

The integrand should be written as 1/(ax + b), or better yet, using LaTeX, as ##\frac 1 {ax + b}##. We have a LaTeX primer here -- https://www.physicsforums.com/help/latexhelp/ -- it's under the INFO menu at the top of the screen, under Help/How-to.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 27 ·
Replies
27
Views
3K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
5K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
4K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
4K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 31 ·
2
Replies
31
Views
5K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K