Why is the domain of this rational function restricted to x > 0?

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the domain restrictions of the rational function \( y = 3x^{\frac{4}{3}} - \frac{3}{32}x^{\frac{2}{3}} \), specifically questioning why it appears to be limited to \( x > 0 \). Participants explore the implications of cube roots and the behavior of graphing software in representing the function.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that cube roots are defined for negative numbers and questions the restriction of the domain to \( x > 0 \).
  • Another participant explains that negative numbers have three distinct cube roots, including complex roots, which may not be handled by all calculators.
  • A participant suggests that the graphing software likely uses exponential representations that are only defined for positive \( x \), leading to the observed domain restriction.
  • Further discussion indicates that rational exponents can complicate the graphing of functions, with specific mention that \( y = x^{2/3} \) is defined for all real numbers while \( y = x^{3/2} \) is restricted to \( x \geq 0 \).
  • One participant expresses confusion about why graphing programs do not account for the full graph when using rational exponents and suggests that factoring the expression might yield the complete graph.
  • Another participant confirms that factoring allows for the entire function to be graphed and expresses surprise at the limitations of graphing software.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the handling of rational exponents in graphing software, with some agreeing that the software's limitations are problematic while others provide explanations for the observed behavior. No consensus is reached regarding the best approach to graph such functions.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention that graphing software may not account for complex roots and that the representation of rational exponents can lead to confusion about domain restrictions. The discussion highlights the need for careful consideration of definitions and assumptions in mathematical expressions.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students and educators in mathematics, particularly those interested in the behavior of rational functions and the implications of graphing software limitations.

raxAdaam
Messages
32
Reaction score
0
When I plot

[itex]y = 3x^{\frac{4}{3}}-\frac{3}{32}x^{\frac{2}{3}}[/itex],

I get: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/5653705/pfgraph1.png


but I don't see any reason for the domain to be restricted to [itex]x > 0[/itex]. There is only a cubic root, which is well defined for negative numbers ... I've tried on a few different programs & always get the same thing, can anyone explain why? Is the domain actually restricted to positive x?

Thanks in advance,


Rax
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Physics news on Phys.org
A negative number has three distinct cube roots. For example, all three of the following are cube roots of ##-1##.

the real root:
$$-1$$
the principal root:
$$e^{i\pi/3} = \cos(\pi/3) + i\sin(\pi/3) = \frac{1}{2} + i\frac{\sqrt{3}}{2}$$
the conjugate of the principal root:
$$e^{-i\pi/3} = \cos(\pi/3) - i\sin(\pi/3) = \frac{1}{2} - i\frac{\sqrt{3}}{2}$$
Many calculators, particularly those that don't handle complex numbers, will give the ##-1## answer. Software packages that know about complex numbers will likely give the principal cube root, which is ##e^{i\pi/3}##.
 
The reason you're getting only the part of the graph for x ≥ 0 is that the software is very likely representing the x4/3 and x2/3 terms in terms of e to some power.

Looking at the first of these functions, we have

$$ x^{4/3} = (e^{\ln x})^{4/3} = e^{4/3 \cdot \ln x}$$

The above is not an identity, since the exponential expressions are defined only for x > 0, whereas the left side is defined for all real numbers.
 
Mark44 said:
The reason you're getting only the part of the graph for x ≥ 0 is that the software is very likely representing the x4/3 and x2/3 terms in terms of e to some power.

Looking at the first of these functions, we have

$$ x^{4/3} = (e^{\ln x})^{4/3} = e^{4/3 \cdot \ln x}$$

The above is not an identity, since the exponential expressions are defined only for x > 0, whereas the left side is defined for all real numbers.

Interesting, and this tends to be the case only for rational exponents? So were I to factor the expression in terms of an integer exponent, I would get the entire graph? How come these programs don't account for this method? Wouldn't it be relatively simple to include the other half of the graph?


Thank you very much for the answer - very insightful!




Rax


PS I tried factoring & re-graphing, and sure enough go the full function! Very cool - thanks a ton, would never have figured that out on my own! Still don't understand why they wouldn't program around that - potentially misleading! Here's the graph rendered for [itex]y = \frac{3}{32}x \left(32x^{\frac{1}{3}} - x^{-\frac{1}{3}}\right)[/itex], for anyone else interested:

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/5653705/pfgraph2.png
 
Last edited by a moderator:
raxAdaam said:
Interesting, and this tends to be the case only for rational exponents?
Assuming you mean rational exponents vs. integer exponents, then yes. There's no problem graphing y = xn, where x is an integer.

For rational exponents, things are different. If r = ##\frac{m}{n}##, with the fraction reduced to lowest terms, we're going to run into problems if n is even, but not if n is odd. This means, for example, that y = x2/3 is defined for all real numbers, while y = x3/2 is defined only for x ≥ 0. I am restricting things to real-valued functions of real variables. I am excluding complex numbers from consideration.

Many graphing packages would use the scheme I described earlier to graph these functions, so for both, only the parts of the graph for which x > 0 would be shown.
raxAdaam said:
So were I to factor the expression in terms of an integer exponent, I would get the entire graph? How come these programs don't account for this method? Wouldn't it be relatively simple to include the other half of the graph?
I don't think it would be all that simple, since the rational exponent would need to be reduced to lowest terms, and then decide whether the denominator was even or odd. At any rate, it's very simple to convert to an exponential form before graphing.
raxAdaam said:
Thank you very much for the answer - very insightful!




Rax


PS I tried factoring & re-graphing, and sure enough go the full function! Very cool - thanks a ton, would never have figured that out on my own! Still don't understand why they wouldn't program around that - potentially misleading! Here's the graph rendered for [itex]y = \frac{3}{32}x \left(32x^{\frac{1}{3}} - x^{-\frac{1}{3}}\right)[/itex], for anyone else interested:

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/5653705/pfgraph2.png
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Similar threads

  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
4K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
2K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
3K
Replies
16
Views
3K