Solving Orbital Plane Alignment of Two Planets

In summary, the problem at hand involves two planets orbiting a much larger sun, with interactions between the planets and the sun as well as between the two planets themselves. The question is whether the orbital planes of the planets will eventually align, and if so, which book or method can be used to solve this problem. The conversation considers the possibility of damping and potential energy as factors, but ultimately concludes that without some other force at work, the planets will likely not become co-planar due to the time-reversibility of point mass n-body problems. Examples of roughly co-planar systems in our solar system are also discussed, as well as the role of tides and equatorial bulges in causing orbital alignments.
  • #1
chronnox
12
0
Im trying to solve (approximately) the following problem: Suppose that i have 2 planets with mass m1 and m2 orbiting around the sun and i take into account the following interactions:
a) Interaction between planet 1 and the sun
b) Interaction between planet 2 and the sun
c) Interaction between planet 1 and planet 2

Where the sun has mas M >> m1,m2 . My physical intuition tells me that this system is similar to a damped harmonical oscillator so at later times the orbital planes of the planets will be aligned, i.e., the angle between the orbital planes will be zero at later times. The problem is that i can't find a book or an article which can help me with this. Does anyone know a good book to start with? or a book with a method to solve this problem?. Finally do you agree with my proposal that the angle between the orbital planes will be zero at later times?.
 
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  • #2
i'm not so sure the alignment will happen. Where does the damping come from?
 
  • #3
It's nice idea. It is not the damping force, i think just potential energy between the 2 planets will get the lowest value when they are aligned.
 
  • #4
Assuming that their orbits are far enough apart that their orbits are stable, their nodes will precess, but they will never become co-planar unless some other force is at work.

One way to think about it is that point mass n-body problems are time reversable. So if they did become co-planar, it would imply that a perfectly co-planar system could also break free of its co-planar state.

We observe a lot of systems that are roughly co-planar in our solar system. The planets around the Sun all orbit within < 20 degrees. The inner moons of Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, and Neptune are roughly co-planar, but they probably formed that way.

Mars has two moons that are roughly co-planar even though they may be captured asteroids. This does imply that there are forces that will make objects co-planar. In this case, I believe it is the tides they raise on Mars, and Mars's equatorial buldge that makes their orbits settle into equatorial orbits. So the moons didn't do it to each other. Mars' non-spherical shape caused them to both become equatorial orbiters.

But the Sun takes 30 days to spin once. It has practically no equatorial buldge. And even if it did, the planets are sufficiently far from the Sun that it could be accurately approximated as a point mass, and the planets would never feel a significant pull from this buldge. Additionally, the planets are too far to pull a significant tide on the surface of the Sun.
 

1. How do you determine the orbital plane alignment of two planets?

The orbital plane alignment of two planets is determined by calculating the inclination, or tilt, of each planet's orbit in relation to a reference plane. This reference plane is typically the plane of the ecliptic, which is the plane of Earth's orbit around the sun.

2. What factors affect the orbital plane alignment of two planets?

The main factors that affect the orbital plane alignment of two planets are their respective inclinations, the positions of their ascending and descending nodes (where their orbits cross the reference plane), and the timing of their orbits in relation to one another.

3. Why is it important to know the orbital plane alignment of two planets?

Understanding the orbital plane alignment of two planets is crucial in predicting and analyzing their interactions, such as gravitational influences and potential collisions. It also helps in planning space missions and determining the best trajectory for spacecraft.

4. How is the orbital plane alignment of two planets measured?

The orbital plane alignment of two planets is typically measured using astronomical observations, such as measuring the angles between the planets' orbits and the reference plane. This can also be done using computer simulations and mathematical calculations.

5. Can the orbital plane alignment of two planets change over time?

Yes, the orbital plane alignment of two planets can change over time due to various factors such as gravitational influences from other planets, comets, or asteroids. This can cause the inclinations and positions of the planets' orbits to shift, ultimately changing their orbital plane alignment.

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