What is the Lagrangian and how does it relate to classical mechanics?

  • Thread starter Char. Limit
  • Start date
  • Tags
    Lagrangian
In summary, the Lagrangian is a concept from classical mechanics that is defined as the difference between the kinetic and potential energy of a system. When applying Euler-Lagrange's equation to the Lagrangian, the original differential equation can be obtained. This concept is important in classical mechanics and can be seen in the principle of least time in classical optics. It is defined as the minimum or maximum value of the integral of the Lagrangian over time. The Lagrangian can be derived for different systems, such as a point mass with a vertical coordinate. However, in the case of a pendulum, the Lagrangian is not applicable.
  • #1
Char. Limit
Gold Member
1,222
22
So I type a differential equation into Wolfram Alpha, like so:

wolframalpha-20110422142905709.gif


And one of the things that W-A outputs is the "Lagrangian" of that equation, which is so:

wolframalpha-20110422142935538.gif


My question is, what is this Lagrangian, what does it describe, and how do I find it?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #2
Yeah I've noticed that too. Look closely, if you apply Euler-Lagrange's equation to that Lagrangian, it'll spit out the original differential equation you put into it.

Tried putting in the differential equation for a pendulum y''(x) + (g/l)siny = 0 (y and x are theta and t respectively) but it didn't give me a Lagrangian. It would be cool if it did.

Edit: And what it describes, well in classical mechanics the definition is the kinetic minus potential energy in terms of the generalized coordinates.

(huge arm-waving here) Hamilton's principle states that if you integrate the lagrangian over time is always such that the resulting integrand is minimum (or maximum). It just so happens that the Euler-Lagrange equation is how you get the integrand (the lagrangian) to be stationary (be it a maximum or a minimum). I know it translates directly into the principle of least time in classical optics and it has a more general definition, but I don't know enough about it. I saw it early on in my mechanics course and is immensely important, but its still quite a mystery to me.

I hope someone reads this and corrects any (likely) mistakes I made in that last statement, but I think that's more or less the general idea.
 
Last edited:
  • #3
Char. Limit said:
My question is, what is this Lagrangian, what does it describe, and how do I find it?

The Lagriangian is from classical mechanics and is defined as

L = T - V

where T is the kinetic energy of the system and V the potential energy.

If for instance a point mass has a vertical coordinate y at time t, the following will hold:

[tex]L(y', y, t) = T - V = \frac 1 2 m y'^2 - m g y[/tex]

According to Lagrangian mechanics we have:

[tex]\frac d {dt} \frac {\partial L} {\partial y'} - \frac {\partial L} {\partial y} = 0[/tex]

which would work out as:

[tex]m y'' + m g = 0[/tex]

Note that this looks a lot like your formula, if only for a different system.Note also that in your case the applicability of the Lagrangian is zero.
 
Last edited:

1. What is a Lagrangian?

A Lagrangian is a mathematical function used in classical mechanics to describe the dynamics of a system. It contains information about the system's position, velocity, and potential energy, and can be used to derive the equations of motion for the system.

2. How is a Lagrangian different from a Hamiltonian?

Both Lagrangians and Hamiltonians are used in classical mechanics, but they have different approaches and applications. The Lagrangian approach uses generalized coordinates to describe the system, while the Hamiltonian approach uses generalized momenta. Additionally, the Lagrangian is a function of position, velocity, and potential energy, while the Hamiltonian is a function of position, momentum, and kinetic energy.

3. When is a Lagrangian used in physics?

A Lagrangian is mainly used in classical mechanics to describe the dynamics of a system. It is also used in other areas of physics, such as quantum mechanics and field theory, to calculate the equations of motion for a system.

4. What is the significance of the Lagrangian in physics?

The Lagrangian is significant because it provides a concise and elegant way to describe the dynamics of a system. It allows for the derivation of equations of motion using the principle of least action, and it also allows for the use of different coordinate systems to describe the same system.

5. Can the Lagrangian be used for any type of system?

Yes, the Lagrangian can be used for any type of system, as long as it can be described by the variables of position, velocity, and potential energy. It is a general approach that can be applied to a wide range of physical systems, from simple particles to complex systems with multiple interacting components.

Similar threads

  • Differential Equations
Replies
4
Views
637
  • Differential Equations
Replies
8
Views
2K
Replies
9
Views
669
  • High Energy, Nuclear, Particle Physics
Replies
2
Views
598
  • Classical Physics
Replies
17
Views
850
Replies
6
Views
324
Replies
3
Views
564
Replies
11
Views
1K
  • High Energy, Nuclear, Particle Physics
Replies
0
Views
498
  • Classical Physics
Replies
5
Views
1K
Back
Top