Can a Leaking Argon Gas Line Draw in Air and Create a Mixture?

In summary, the conversation discusses the use of an argon line for atomization and backfilling in a VIM melting chamber. The question is whether a leak in the argon line will draw in air and create a mixture of argon and air. The speaker also mentions the importance of considering the pressure and flow rate when determining if air is being pulled into the system. It is mentioned that the system is initially purged of air, but there may still be leaks when backfilling with argon. The use of helium and soap and water for leak detection is also mentioned.
  • #1
Bladestein
6
0
I have an argon line used for atomization and backfilling a VIM melting chamber. If there is a leak on the argon line (at a fitting, valve, etc), will this leak actually draw in air when gas is turned on and flowing through pipe creating a mixture of argon and air?
 
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  • #2
Bladestein said:
gas is turned on and flowing through pipe
Is the argon under pressure as in mig welding systems or is it drawn into the chamber by the vacuum?
 
  • #3
Pressure line.
 
  • #4
If the pressure is considerably higher than atmospheric pressure I can't image it would draw in air, but according to the Bernoulli principle the higher velocity of the flow the lower the pressure that accompanies it, so the flow rate and the pressure have to be considered. Can we assume the air has been purged from the system initially?
 
  • #5
jerromyjon said:
If the pressure is considerably higher than atmospheric pressure I can't image it would draw in air, but according to the Bernoulli principle the higher velocity of the flow the lower the pressure that accompanies it, so the flow rate and the pressure have to be considered. Can we assume the air has been purged from the system initially?
Air has been purged from the system in theory. System pulls vacuum to remove air then back filled with argon. But when backfilling is air being pulled in also.
 
  • #6
Bladestein said:
But when backfilling is air being pulled in also.
Yes that would definitely drawn in air if there is a leak, and argon molecules are larger so they might not leak out when the system is pressurized.
Can you verify if the vacuum holds? That's how I detect leaks in air conditioning systems prior to filling them with freon.
 
  • #7
We pull a vacuum to approximately 200mTorr and then leak check for 1 minute. We get leaks of 20-50 which in my opinion is no good. We helium check for leaks but even if we had a leak up of 20 the helium check finds no leaks. The end result is out of spec oxygen on our final product. We could be pulling air through leaks in chamber even when back filled with argon and/or the argon line that pumps argon into the chamber for backfill could have leaks that also pulls air into chamber
 
  • #8
I think I may be stumped as well for solutions, the only one I have left to think of is soap and water. Pressurize the system and get spraying...
 

1. What is the Venturi effect on gas line?

The Venturi effect on gas line is a phenomenon where the velocity of a gas increases as it passes through a narrow section of a pipe, while the pressure decreases. This is due to the conservation of energy principle, where the kinetic energy of the gas increases as its potential energy decreases in the narrow section of the pipe.

2. How does the Venturi effect affect gas flow rate?

The Venturi effect can increase the gas flow rate through a pipe by creating a pressure difference between the wider and narrower sections. This pressure difference causes the gas to accelerate and flow faster through the pipe.

3. What are the applications of the Venturi effect on gas lines?

The Venturi effect on gas lines has various applications in industries such as chemical processing, oil and gas, and HVAC systems. It is used to measure flow rate, control gas flow, and create vacuum pressure.

4. How does the shape and size of the Venturi affect gas flow?

The shape and size of the Venturi affect gas flow by determining the velocity and pressure of the gas. A narrower and longer Venturi will result in a higher gas velocity and a greater pressure difference, while a wider and shorter Venturi will have a lower velocity and pressure difference.

5. Can the Venturi effect be used to reduce gas pressure?

Yes, the Venturi effect can be used to reduce gas pressure by creating a pressure difference between the wider and narrower sections of the pipe. This is commonly used in natural gas pipelines to regulate and control the pressure of the gas.

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