China bans reincarnating without government permission

In summary: So who decides what is "unphysical" doctrine? And isn't that essentially trying to control thought? I think we should be free to believe and practice whatever religion we choose, as long as it doesn't harm others.In summary, the Chinese government has issued a law that will go into effect next month, which strictly regulates the procedures for reincarnation. This move is seen as an attempt to institutionalize the management of reincarnation and gives the government the power to choose the next Dalai Lama. Many see this as a power grab and a violation of religious freedom.
  • #1
RetardedBastard
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The government of China is making moves to "institutionalize management of reincarnation."

According to a statement issued by the State Administration for Religious Affairs, the law, which goes into effect next month and strictly stipulates the procedures by which one is to reincarnate, is "an important move to institutionalize management of reincarnation."

...

By barring any Buddhist monk living outside China from seeking reincarnation, the law effectively gives Chinese authorities the power to choose the next Dalai Lama, whose soul, by tradition, is reborn as a new human to continue the work of relieving suffering.

Government managing reincarnation? LOL. I was under the, apparently incorrect, impression that the government of China would cease making obvious fools of themselves before the '08 Olympics.

Ooops! Greg, I hope I didn't just get PF banned in China for you.
 
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  • #2
Stop! Do you have permission to reincarnate?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20227400/site/newsweek/

In one of history's more absurd acts of totalitarianism, China has banned Buddhist monks in Tibet from reincarnating without government permission. According to a statement issued by the State Administration for Religious Affairs, the law, which goes into effect next month and strictly stipulates the procedures by which one is to reincarnate, is "an important move to institutionalize management of reincarnation."

I'm not sure what to make of this...:confused::smile::mad::rolleyes::frown::cry:
 
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  • #3
Maybe it is always April 1st over there in China and everyone is having a good laugh at this.

Zz.
 
  • #4
Well, at least they aren't banning it altogether. It just requires a bit more paperwork than it used to. :rolleyes:
 
  • #5
neutrino said:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20227400/site/newsweek/



I'm not sure what to make of this...:confused::smile::mad::rolleyes::frown::cry:

2 minutes too late :)
 
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  • #6
RetardedBastard said:
2 minutes too late :)

Yup. I realized that you also check /. every few minutes, after I posted the thread. :-p :wink:
 
  • #7
I wonder how they plan on enforcing this law! :rolleyes:
 
  • #8
neutrino said:
Yup. I realized that you also check /. every few minutes, after I posted the thread. :-p :wink:

Doesn't everyone? :)
 
  • #9
neutrino said:
Yup. I realized that you also check /. every few minutes, after I posted the thread. :-p :wink:
Ah! That explains the nearly concurrent threads started about a story I read two weeks ago!
 
  • #10
G01 said:
I wonder how they plan on enforcing this law! :rolleyes:

Ghostbusters?
I am absolutely astounded. Every time that I think I've already seen the stupidest possible thing on the face of the planet, something like this shows up...
 
  • #11
Will anyone believe that the government can override what is destined? Wouldn't that require a belief that the Government has more power than their spiritual beliefs?
 
  • #12
It's probably just a cost saving measure for government forms.
Otherwise your drving license would have to have "Date of Birth", "Previous Date of Birth", "Next Date of Birth" etc...
 
  • #13
I only hope we don't see a influx of alien immigrant ghost spirits!
 
  • #14
RetardedBastard said:
By barring any Buddhist monk living outside China from seeking reincarnation, the law effectively gives Chinese authorities the power to choose the next Dalai Lama, whose soul, by tradition, is reborn as a new human to continue the work of relieving suffering.

Everyone does realize that this is a pure power grab, right? It is not a good sign, but I don't think China or anyone else stands any chance of putting the lid on this [religion], information technology, or free thought. The cat is already out of the bag.
 
  • #15
Danger said:
Every time that I think I've already seen the stupidest possible thing on the face of the planet, something like this shows up...

Well, I personally believe, that the reason people are doing stupider and stupider things is that many people don't have brains and we should give the people in China, South African brains, and Chinese, such as in Iraq and South Africa, will, you know, for the children.....
 
  • #16
berkeman said:
Well, at least they aren't banning it altogether. It just requires a bit more paperwork than it used to. :rolleyes:

mgb_phys said:
It's probably just a cost saving measure for government forms.
Otherwise your drving license would have to have "Date of Birth", "Previous Date of Birth", "Next Date of Birth" etc...

:smile: I wonder what the penalties are if you reincarnate without permission?
 
  • #17
G01 said:
Well, I personally believe, that the reason people are doing stupider and stupider things is that many people don't have brains and we should give the people in China, South African brains, and Chinese, such as in Iraq and South Africa, will, you know, for the children.....

I think I would be scared if I understood what you just said... :confused: :smile:
 
  • #18
G01 said:
Well, I personally believe, that the reason people are doing stupider and stupider things is that many people don't have brains and we should give the people in China, South African brains, and Chinese, such as in Iraq and South Africa, will, you know, for the children.....

I think GO1 is going to have to do very well in the swimsuit competition to win this!
 
  • #19
I'm going play Meph and say I'm with China on this one. In fact, I'll go further and say that goverments should treat all religious proselytising and preaching of unphysical doctrine as equivalent to fraud and hold the church/mosque/temple/monastery liable for criminal charges.
 
  • #20
mgb_phys said:
I think GO1 is going to have to do very well in the swimsuit competition to win this!

I just blanked on that question! Let me go on Good Morning America and answer it again, and you'll see I know what I'm talking about!
 
  • #21
The hypocrites just want to insure Mao's fate in the next dialectic.
 
  • #22
Gokul43201 said:
I'm going play Meph and say I'm with China on this one. In fact, I'll go further and say that goverments should treat all religious proselytising and preaching of unphysical doctrine as equivalent to fraud and hold the church/mosque/temple/monastery liable for criminal charges.

And who would you assign as the truth police?

Oh wait, unphysical doctrine! You would ban the teaching of all beliefs not based in science?
 
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  • #23
Is what America doing right in Mid-east currently? in terms of the American people? in terms of Iraq people? in terms of the whole world? in terms of world peace? ...

What WAS their relationship?

I would say I am not sure what the Chinese government is doing. But politics stuff is NOT WORTH laughing at like some people in this forum do.

American government may be is doing well for the benefict of the American people. But what do you people elsewhere think of the American government?
 
  • #24
uiulic said:
Is what America doing right in Mid-east currently? in terms of the American people? in terms of Iraq people? in terms of the whole world? in terms of world peace? ...

What WAS their relationship?

I would say I am not sure what the Chinese government is doing. But politics stuff is NOT WORTH laughing at like some people in this forum do.

American government may be is doing well for the benefict of the American people. But what do you people elsewhere think of the American government?

That they'd like to be born in America in their next life?

Two problems with that hope:

1) Tom Tancredo will probably introduce legislation banning non-American citizens from being reincarnated in the USA.

2) Even if the bill fails, the US national debt is financed by China.

Clearly a case of Murphy's Law of Reincarnation.
 
  • #25
Ivan Seeking said:
Oh wait, unphysical doctrine! You would ban the teaching of all beliefs not based in science?
No. Only all beliefs falsified by science. Unfalsifiable claptrap will still slip through. :biggrin:
 
  • #26
Gokul43201 said:
No. Only all beliefs falsified by science. Unfalsifiable claptrap will still slip through. :biggrin:

Still won't work - "God the trickster" is still a logical default.
 
  • #27
Ivan Seeking said:
Still won't work - "God the trickster" is still a logical default.
Not sure I follow. How does that work with say, "the Sun and Moon go round the Earth" or with "the Earth is older than the Sun and Moon and all three are less than 10,000 years old" or with "God will banish this arthritis from your body"?
 
  • #28
The idea of an omnipotent being allows that the entire universe is nothing but a ruse designed to test our faith - a grand cosmic hoax intended to fool those silly scientists.

In fact this has been used on me before. When I point to the light from distant stars as evidence of time passed, the response was ~: God made the universe to look like there was a big bang, but there really wasn’t one and we know because the bible tells us that the universe isn’t that old.
 
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  • #29
Since we are all forced to live within the hoax, it is in the best interests of goverments that people know the rules of the hoax than the completely useless rules of the "real universe" that no one has been yet able to glimpse.

Or better still, governments can require anyone postulating the existence of an omnipotent being to demonstrate that the existence of such being not lead to logical contradictions. This will require the postulator to come up with a complete set of axioms that include/permit the existence of an omnipotent being; that are internally self-consistent; and that are consistent with observation (even if through the 'trickster' trick). Once such axioms are accepted, all preachings will be required to remain consistent with these axioms. (Naturally, this will cause all kinds of problems for postulators of omnipotents - paradoxes arising out of the "set of all sets" within ZFC come to mind.)
 
  • #30
Moonbear said:
:smile: I wonder what the penalties are if you reincarnate without permission?
You are executed...

GArth
 
  • #31
Gokul43201 said:
Or better still, governments can require anyone postulating the existence of an omnipotent being to demonstrate that the existence of such being not lead to logical contradictions.

God works in mysterious ways. How can we as mere mortals ever hope to understand the actions of an omniscient and omnipotent being?

Doesn't omnipotence eliminate the need for logical consistency? ...and the water became wine. They fed thousands with a single loaf of bread, etc. Part of the justification for believing in omnipotence are "demonstrated" logical inconsistencies, otherwise known as miracles.

Keep them coming, I have 4000 years worth of one-liners. :biggrin:
 
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  • #32
Ivan Seeking said:
God works in mysterious ways. How can we as mere mortals ever hope to understand the actions of an omniscient and omnipotent being?

Doesn't omnipotence eliminate the need for logical consistency? ...and the water became wine. They fed thousands with a single loaf of bread, etc. Part of the justification for believing in omnipotence are "demonstrated" logical inconsistencies, otherwise known as miracles.
Miracles are not themselves logical inconsitencies within an axiomatic system that permits them. However, the axiomatic system itself must be free of internal inconsistencies.

For instance, the existence of a universal set (which I'm loosely associating with the existence of omnipotence) produces a paradox (Cantor's) within ZFC, but not within an NF axiomatic framework.
 
  • #33
How is turning water into wine and feeding thousands with a single loaf logically inconsistent? It may be physically impossible, but there is nothing logically inconsistent about it.
 
  • #34
Gokul43201 said:
For instance, the existence of a universal set (which I'm loosely associating with the existence of omnipotence) produces a paradox (Cantor's) within ZFC, but not within an NF axiomatic framework.

what is ZFC and NF?

You would actually expect that this could be applied? It sure would have made L.A. Law more interesting, but I think you might be spending too much time in the Ivory tower. :biggrin:

Or are you complaining about the possibility of God making a rock so heavy that even he can't lift it? In God's eyes all things are possible. You are looking at the problem through those limited mortal eyes again.

Obviously God is a fan of The Many Worlds Theory.
 
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  • #35
Ivan Seeking said:
what is ZFC and NF?

ZFC : Zermelo-Fraenkel with (Axiom of) Choice

NF : New Foundation
 
<h2>1. What does "China bans reincarnating without government permission" mean?</h2><p>This means that in China, individuals are not allowed to claim to be reincarnations of deceased individuals without the approval of the Chinese government.</p><h2>2. Why did China implement this ban?</h2><p>This ban was implemented in order to control the influence of Tibetan Buddhism and to maintain political stability in China.</p><h2>3. How does the Chinese government regulate reincarnation?</h2><p>The Chinese government requires individuals who claim to be reincarnations to obtain approval and certification from the State Administration for Religious Affairs.</p><h2>4. What happens if someone claims to be a reincarnation without government permission?</h2><p>If someone claims to be a reincarnation without government permission, they may face legal consequences such as fines or imprisonment.</p><h2>5. Does this ban apply to all religions in China?</h2><p>Yes, this ban applies to all religions in China and is not specific to Tibetan Buddhism. It is seen as a way for the Chinese government to exert control over all religious practices in the country.</p>

Related to China bans reincarnating without government permission

1. What does "China bans reincarnating without government permission" mean?

This means that in China, individuals are not allowed to claim to be reincarnations of deceased individuals without the approval of the Chinese government.

2. Why did China implement this ban?

This ban was implemented in order to control the influence of Tibetan Buddhism and to maintain political stability in China.

3. How does the Chinese government regulate reincarnation?

The Chinese government requires individuals who claim to be reincarnations to obtain approval and certification from the State Administration for Religious Affairs.

4. What happens if someone claims to be a reincarnation without government permission?

If someone claims to be a reincarnation without government permission, they may face legal consequences such as fines or imprisonment.

5. Does this ban apply to all religions in China?

Yes, this ban applies to all religions in China and is not specific to Tibetan Buddhism. It is seen as a way for the Chinese government to exert control over all religious practices in the country.

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