Sample smaller than parallel plates in capacitance setup

In summary, the conversation discusses the setup for measuring parallel plate capacitance and the issue of obtaining accurate values for dielectric constants of materials. The problem of measuring capacitance with a sample area smaller than that of the parallel plates is brought up, and the question of how to subtract the contribution of air is raised. The expert suggests treating the setup as two capacitors in parallel and offers alternative solutions, such as making new plates or using a substitution method. The expert also confirms that the approach of treating it as two capacitors in parallel should work and clarifies the areas that should be used for each capacitor.
  • #1
SSChemist
2
0
Hi,

My setup for measuring parallel plate capacitance consists of an LCR meter and a parallel plate test fixture. The area of the parallel plates is much larger than the area of the samples I am measuring. From what I've seen in literature, and my physics classes, the sample area should be either equal or larger than that of the parallel plates. I haven't been able to find any information on capacitance measurements where the sample area is smaller than that of the plates. My goal is to obtain accurate values for dielectric constants of materials.

The problem: When measuring capacitance of a sample with smaller area than the area of the parallel plates, the obtained capacitance includes a contribution from both air and the sample.

The question: How does one "subtract" the air contribution? Is there a way to obtain accurate values for dielectric constant with the setup described above?

My attempt: The closest approximation of dielectric constants I was able to get was when I treat the entire setup (air + sample) as two capacitors connected in parallel; that is, C(total) = C(air) + C(sample). Using this approximation, most of the dielectric constants were within 10% error with a few being higher than 10%. However, I know that this is not correct because the area (A) in the parallel capacitance equation ( C = k e A / d) refers to the area of the parallel plates, not the sample. In my case, for C(sample), I am using the area of the sample itself.

Any thoughts would be helpful.
 
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  • #2
Why can't you just make some new plates the right size to match the samples ?
 
  • #3
I would do that but I wouldn't have a way to connect the leads to the newly made plates. Also, I have a variety of sample sizes, so one plate size/shape would not fit all. Keep in mind, the samples are tiny, areas of about 25 mm2 and the area of the plates on the test fixture is 3180 mm2.
 
  • #4
(1) Something more like a probe than a plate as such . Copper rod . Machined end face is the plate . Reduce diameter of bar for a distance above plate then revert to full diameter for holding and connections .

(2) I have some memory of reading about a substitution method for the case of plates bigger in area than the dielectric separator . Can't give a reference but works something like testing with sample in place and then removing sample without altering plate separation and then inferring the dielectric properties from the difference of capacitance readings .
 
  • #5
probe v2.png
 
  • #6
Your approach of treating it as two capacitors in parallel should work. I don't follow why you think it doesn't. The area of C(sample) should be the area of the sample. The area of C(air) should be the area of the plates minus the sample. Is that what you were doing?
 

1. How does the size of the sample affect the capacitance in a parallel plate setup?

The capacitance in a parallel plate setup is directly proportional to the size of the sample. This means that a smaller sample will have a smaller capacitance, while a larger sample will have a larger capacitance.

2. Why is it important to have a small sample in a capacitance setup?

A small sample in a capacitance setup allows for a more precise and accurate measurement of the capacitance. This is because a smaller sample has a lower chance of having any external factors that could affect the measurement, such as uneven surfaces or variations in material composition.

3. What is the relationship between the distance between the plates and the sample size in a parallel plate setup?

In a parallel plate setup, the distance between the plates and the sample size have an inverse relationship. This means that as the distance between the plates increases, the sample size decreases, and vice versa.

4. Can a sample be too small for a parallel plate capacitance setup?

Yes, a sample can be too small for a parallel plate capacitance setup. If the sample is too small, the capacitance measurement may not be accurate or reliable. It is important to choose a sample size that is appropriate for the equipment being used.

5. How can the size of the sample be determined in a capacitance setup?

The size of the sample in a capacitance setup can be determined by using a tool, such as a ruler or caliper, to measure its dimensions. It is important to measure the sample accurately, as even small discrepancies can affect the capacitance measurement.

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